So, I'll keep a running experiment with amp only - no pedals - to see what I can get out of it. But could either of you (or anyone else on the board) download the best of the clips with the pedal (outerEdgeOverSeam.mp3), throw it in a DAW, and with an EQ identify what you're defining as the "nasty" or "scratchy" frequencies? I know there will likely be a range of frequencies, and the magic is all in how it sounds, not how it looks or computes out numerically, but it would help knowing roughly what areas of the frequency spectrum to listen for.JD01 wrote: ↑Wed Jan 23, 2019 5:34 am Outer edge over seem is a bit nicer and brighter - its still a bit scratchy sounding though.
Mmmm, the clean does sounds nice actually.
The full vol. version just magnifies the problems with the 70% clip - just that its a bit scratchy. Maybe like you need to try and go a little farther out from the seem and then if it starts sounding too dark, dial the amp in to be brighter.
No pedal - this one much better to me. The scratchy spikiness is reduced, its still clearly over driving, but way less than when you have the pedal in front. I reckon this is the best of your overdriven clips.
The Tone Thread
Re: The Tone Thread
awesome youtube comment of the day
Bill and Ted time traveled and brought a bass player from 1973, a drummer from 1984 and a guitar player from 1995. Now they're spreading peace all over the world
Bill and Ted time traveled and brought a bass player from 1973, a drummer from 1984 and a guitar player from 1995. Now they're spreading peace all over the world
Re: The Tone Thread
You've got the spiky stuff happening. Just by listening I guessed it was way up around 6-7k. I put the track into my DAW and that's exactly where the nastiest stuff is happening.SweetDan wrote: ↑Wed Jan 23, 2019 8:44 pm
So, I'll keep a running experiment with amp only - no pedals - to see what I can get out of it. But could either of you (or anyone else on the board) download the best of the clips with the pedal (outerEdgeOverSeam.mp3), throw it in a DAW, and with an EQ identify what you're defining as the "nasty" or "scratchy" frequencies? I know there will likely be a range of frequencies, and the magic is all in how it sounds, not how it looks or computes out numerically, but it would help knowing roughly what areas of the frequency spectrum to listen for.
I gave it a very basic EQ two different ways that yield pretty much the same results.
First EQ - a pretty big notch right damn neat at 7khz on the nose. Find the worst of it, and adjust the reduction and bandwith to grab only the nasty stuff. I thought this sounded pretty okay. It'd work in a mix IMO.
Second EQ - a simple low pass. The cutoff on the low pass can vary depending on how you set the slope. I started the rolloff pretty early, but the slope is aggressive, so everything right up to the drop-off is still pretty strong, then that harshness gets rolled off. I think I like this one better.
Both methods yielded pretty much the same results. Huge difference in the hissy harsh high end when I'd flip the EQ on and off.
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Rebel Yell
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WhiskeyJack
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Re: The Tone Thread
Lol. Sure, but do we really need that? Just say you like something.
Also....no need to record stereo tracks if you're just miking one speaker with one mic. You really don't need stereo tracks at all unless you're recording an actual stereo image. Just record in mono. One performance, one guitar, one amp, one speaker, one mic...mono.
Rebel Yell
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WhiskeyJack
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Re: The Tone Thread
likeGreg_L wrote: ↑Wed Jan 23, 2019 11:38 pmLol. Sure, but do we really need that? Just say you like something.
Also....no need to record stereo tracks if you're just miking one speaker with one mic. You really don't need stereo tracks at all unless you're recording an actual stereo image. Just record in mono. One performance, one guitar, one amp, one speaker, one mic...mono.
Re: The Tone Thread
Thanks for sharing the EQ suggestions. I Like It!Greg_L wrote: ↑Wed Jan 23, 2019 11:38 pmLol. Sure, but do we really need that? Just say you like something.
Also....no need to record stereo tracks if you're just miking one speaker with one mic. You really don't need stereo tracks at all unless you're recording an actual stereo image. Just record in mono. One performance, one guitar, one amp, one speaker, one mic...mono.
Later today, when I'm not working, I'll try the same EQ tweaks in my DAW, and flip back and forth; hearing the difference for myself should be educational (especially with a track I recorded, as opposed to listening to somebody else's stuff on a YT video or something).
Yes, I know about the stereo/mono recording thing; I think what you see here has something to do with how in my DAW I'm exporting only a selection out of the raw recording -- the easiest way to export it is to select a section and hit "mixdown", which it would be processed through the master bus and make into a stereo track, even if the track I select from is mono. (And yes, I did record all these clips with a single mic onto a mono track.)
awesome youtube comment of the day
Bill and Ted time traveled and brought a bass player from 1973, a drummer from 1984 and a guitar player from 1995. Now they're spreading peace all over the world
Bill and Ted time traveled and brought a bass player from 1973, a drummer from 1984 and a guitar player from 1995. Now they're spreading peace all over the world
Re: The Tone Thread
Sorry the pics are kind of hard to see. I'm not that savvy with screenshots. Download them and enlarge to see the actual EQ settings.SweetDan wrote: ↑Thu Jan 24, 2019 11:00 am
Thanks for sharing the EQ suggestions. I Like It!
Later today, when I'm not working, I'll try the same EQ tweaks in my DAW, and flip back and forth; hearing the difference for myself should be educational (especially with a track I recorded, as opposed to listening to somebody else's stuff on a YT video or something).
Yes, I know about the stereo/mono recording thing; I think what you see here has something to do with how in my DAW I'm exporting only a selection out of the raw recording -- the easiest way to export it is to select a section and hit "mixdown", which it would be processed through the master bus and make into a stereo track, even if the track I select from is mono. (And yes, I did record all these clips with a single mic onto a mono track.)
Rebel Yell
Re: The Tone Thread
cool ...... I don't even know how to do screen grabs at all.
May as well start with this!
May as well start with this!
Re: The Tone Thread
OK, such is the pace of work around here at the moment I've only just got around to re-tracking these tones with a pushed mid!JD01 wrote: ↑Sun Jan 20, 2019 1:47 pm OK, been tweaking my rhythm tone a bit again this evening and I'm pretty happy with this.
Its my Crimson with Muttbucker on the left and my tele on the right. I adjusted a bunch of stuff with the tele tone and I think it helps it sit with the Crimson tone much better. Basically I'm well pleased with this, but if anyone has any bright ideas, go for it.
Latest Rhythm Tone.mp3
Latest Rhythm Tone in Mix.mp3
While this was pretty loud in the room, it was a reasonable volume in the house so its the sort of thing I'll be able to carry on doing which is good.
a)I'm surprised by how different they don't sound recorded. The difference is pretty marked in the room.
b)I think I slightly prefer the scoopy sound - they're not that different though.
I've quoted myself here as much for my own benefit as I find the site player quite handy for pausing and switching between tones.
Bugger - didn't work. I'll reupload the old tones. I reckon all the mid push has done is made them sound thin.... they do seem to sit in the mix slightly better though.
Re: The Tone Thread
How did you actually "push" the mids? Did you just EQ a hump into them? Did you actually turn up the mids on the amp?
I wouldn't say they sound thin. Your midrange seems to be centered higher up in the spectrum though and it's removed the mushy hollowness in the low mids. That's good. The pushed mid tracks sound more forward in the mix and less empty, so that's good too. Just find the balance where the mid control overlaps with the low and treble on your amp. Your mid control might bleed into the highs when you turn it up. So as mids go up, treble can come down. That's not uncommon. Or as gain goes up, mids can go up and lows can almost be rolled off to nothing.
Your previous tone settings were way better though IMO. They had a nice openness and depth to them. The highs were a lot smoother. These unfortunately sound like flattened amp sims.
I wouldn't say they sound thin. Your midrange seems to be centered higher up in the spectrum though and it's removed the mushy hollowness in the low mids. That's good. The pushed mid tracks sound more forward in the mix and less empty, so that's good too. Just find the balance where the mid control overlaps with the low and treble on your amp. Your mid control might bleed into the highs when you turn it up. So as mids go up, treble can come down. That's not uncommon. Or as gain goes up, mids can go up and lows can almost be rolled off to nothing.
Your previous tone settings were way better though IMO. They had a nice openness and depth to them. The highs were a lot smoother. These unfortunately sound like flattened amp sims.
Rebel Yell
Re: The Tone Thread
Oh, I pushed the EQ up on the amp. Maybe I went a little far.
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CrowsofFritz
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Re: The Tone Thread
I’ve forgotten that Windows 7 is pretty old by now. I’m still using the prt scrn button.
“Naaaaaaaaaah man. I ain’t touching that mic. That thing’s expensive!”
Re: The Tone Thread
Ok, playing some catch-up here guys...
The "Clean" clip sounds best to me dude, followed by "outerEdgeOverSeam"...
This is a pretty good clip IMO Dan, I think the pedal is adding a bunch of harsh upper-mid/highs, but you may be able to tweak that out using the amp & pedal's tone/eq...They're not terrible by any means so don't get discouraged...SweetDan wrote: ↑Wed Jan 23, 2019 2:08 am noPedal.mp3
It feels like a totally different animal, though, and it sounds like it got all woolly again. (And this is after doing many takes where I'd tweak the gain, volume, and tone controls on the amp.) With the pedal on the sound to me is much more open and present; without, it's ...blah... Tell me if y'all hear something different in this clip.
So, what could I do, given the gear I've got, to get a good (better than "good enough") distorted sound, when the only thing that sounds good is the modeled clean? (Note there are several amp models on this unit, and maybe their distortion sounds better, but I'd need to spend lots of time with each to get them dialed in.) In my mind, the situation looks like this:
- best: buy a tube amp; pros: best sound, cons: $$$ or $$$$ or $$$$$
- better: choose the best clean amp model, run the guitar through effects pedals into that; pros: cost isn't outrageous (given I'm DIY-ing the pedals); cons: lots of work to sound merely "good enough"
- worst: use only the modeled sounds on the amp; pros: no additional cost at all, cons: worst sound, still quite a bit of work to dial it in
Great point made about learning what your gear will/won't do before you start spending $$$ on another amp...You may already have what you're after, but just haven't found it yet...If you wanna buy a nice, new tube amp, more power to ya, but again, what you may already have what you're after, but you just haven't found it yet...Keep after it...
Gibson, Fender, Ibanez, Jackson
Ceriatone, Marshall, EVH
TC Electronic, MXR, Yamaha
My music @ Reverbnation
Re: The Tone Thread
These are pretty good Jdude, but to me they still have the funky low-end thing I mentioned...It sounds kinda like when a Greenback speaker is pushed too hard, but remember all this is subjective...You may like something that I don't, so in the end, it's all up to what you like...
I gotta say it again though, with the new amp/cab, your tones have improved leaps & bounds...
Gibson, Fender, Ibanez, Jackson
Ceriatone, Marshall, EVH
TC Electronic, MXR, Yamaha
My music @ Reverbnation
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WhiskeyJack
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Re: The Tone Thread
Does that thing come default pinned to task bar or are we just lame enough to have it pinned there 24-7
Re: The Tone Thread
Nah, I just use it heaps at work so have it pinned to the taskbar on my work laptop.WhiskeyJack wrote: ↑Sun Jan 27, 2019 4:56 pmDoes that thing come default pinned to task bar or are we just lame enough to have it pinned there 24-7