The Tone Thread

[WhiskeyJack]

Here's the raw guitar from the mix clip I just posted...The mix clip has reverb, but this doesn't, no fx...


Signal chain: Strat Hardhead bridge HB > Mini Tubescreamer> Mini JCM 800 > Greenback >SM57

• TS9:
  Level:...................10
  Gain:.....................0
  Tone:....................6

• Mini 800:
  20w mode
  Presence:..................6
  Bass:.......................8
  Mid:........................7
  Treble:.....................4
  Master Volume:........2.5
  Gain:......................10

Strat bridge HB-TS9-Mini 800-GB-SM57 10-26-2019.mp3

This clip was recorded with the volume at 2.5, & I honestly believe I could play a gig with it at this volume...This is a loud little amp...The more I play through the Lil' 800, the more I wanna play...I know I'm still jizzin' in my panties over it, but it's a killer little amp...

That amp is a winner miner dude. That is you. I dig it. 2.5 hahah. Whatever. What a beast. I'd really love to know what it is that goes into certain small amps that end up making them sound so much bigger. That 30W orange of mine doesn't really sound like a 30W. more like 50. It can hit bleeding ear levels. No idea why. Maybe the cabs? Maybe if i was hitting a 1x12 or a 2x12 that could be the reason? I don't know.

I think you did yourself right with that purchase dude!

[WhiskeyJack]

Bass in a mix.mp3

This is pretty rad man. good job. What did you do different. It sounds a bit more lively and present than your previous bass tones?

[WhiskeyJack]

Here is an experiment with the routing of my motu interface. I routed from the motu mic input to the SPDIF out and into the SPDIF of the TC G Major 2. Then from the SPDIF output of the TC back into the motu SPDIF. This virtually bypasses the TC converters and uses the motu converters only.
The clip starts out with the dry distorted guitar, then I add the flanger ,and then delay and reverb.
TC Flanger Test.mp3

This sounds like an intro to an 80's metal song about about outer space alien babes that like to do weird experiments on pimply metal boys.

[JD01]

Bass in a mix.mp3

This is pretty rad man. good job. What did you do different. It sounds a bit more lively and present than your previous bass tones?

I added a distortion/compressor VST that I normally use for vocals called Camel Crusher to it and tweaked it for a while. I now have a bass chain saved that I can add to other mixes.

[Minerman]

That amp is a winner miner dude. That is you. I dig it. 2.5 hahah. Whatever. What a beast. I'd really love to know what it is that goes into certain small amps that end up making them sound so much bigger. That 30W orange of mine doesn't really sound like a 30W. more like 50. It can hit bleeding ear levels. No idea why. Maybe the cabs? Maybe if i was hitting a 1x12 or a 2x12 that could be the reason? I don't know.

I think you did yourself right with that purchase dude!

Thanks Shan...
I really, really like this amp, it's much more than I expected it to be...The dirt sounds are glorious (to me anyway), but it can do great clean sounds too using the low input...It's only rated @ 20w, but it can pretty much keep up with the 50w Chupacabra...

This is the first "little" amp I've had that doesn't sound little, to me anyway...I really like this amp dude...

Thanks again...

[Minerman]

Just for shits-n-giggles, here's a little clip to keep our thread alive dudes....
This has fx on it, the whole hillbilly 9 yards, complete with a limiter slapped on the master...

sHiT mIx 11-08-2019.mp3

[JD01]

Just for shits-n-giggles, here's a little clip to keep our thread alive dudes....
This has fx on it, the whole hillbilly 9 yards, complete with a limiter slapped on the master...

sHiT mIx 11-08-2019.mp3

That sounds fucking great, miner!
Is that you drumming on the e-kit?

[rayc]

[mention]Minerman[/mention] ,
That's an ace bit of Sabbath - well done.

[Greg_L]

Just for shits-n-giggles, here's a little clip to keep our thread alive dudes....
This has fx on it, the whole hillbilly 9 yards, complete with a limiter slapped on the master...

sHiT mIx 11-08-2019.mp3

Sounds cool miner!

[Lt. Bob]

little amp kicks ass dude!
I'm liking it a lot.

[Minerman]

That sounds fucking great, miner!
Is that you drumming on the e-kit?

Thanks Jdude, I did play some of this on the e-kit, but sadly, most of it has been edited pretty heavily...

[mention]rayc[/mention]
Thanks Ray...

[mention]Greg_L[/mention]
Thanks Gerg...

[mention]Lt. Bob[/mention]
Thanks Lt., I like the Mini 800 a lot myself...It's still kinda hard for me to comprehend I have a JCM 800, even if it is the kiddie-version...

[WhiskeyJack]

That sounds deadly miner! Great job all around man. That is a fanstastic sound you got coming out of that thing!!!

[Minerman]

That sounds deadly miner! Great job all around man. That is a fanstastic sound you got coming out of that thing!!!

Thanks Shan...Believe it or not, that was the lowly Boss DS-1 ran through the Mini 800...

[Tadpui]

[mention]Minerman[/mention] damn, that sounds excellent! Classic Marshall plus a little extra hair on it. I really like those tones.

[Greg_L]

[mention]rayc[/mention] and anyone else that might give shit.

This is the difference between PRE phase inverter master volume, and POST phase inverter master volume on Plexi/Bassman type amps that don't have their own master volumes.

Gibson Les Paul Traditional - Muttbucker PAF bridge
Marshall 1987 50w Plexi
Presence - 4
Bass - 5
Mid - 6
Treb - 4
Bright channel 1 vol - 5
High input only
Marshall 1960B 4x12 - Celestion G12-65
MXL R144 on axis, 3" off grill, dead center - Shure SM57 on axis, 3" off grill, just outside dustcap
50/50 mic blend
No FX or EQ

First up, the amp in it's natural state. No master volume.

1987 full.mp3

Turned down 50% with POST phase inverter master volume.

1987 POST PIMV 50%.mp3

Turned down 50% with PRE phase inverter master volume

1987 PRE PIMV 50%.mp3

This is without adjusting the mic preamps. Full loud is the baseline, and the others are relative to full loud. As you can tell, the amount of volume reduction between pre and post master volumes is different. And so is what it does to the tone. By cutting the signal before the phase inverter, it loses a lot of grind. The phase inverter, as part of the power section, obviously plays a big part in the tone. If I cut it back even further/quieter, the tone thins out even more. The preamp section alone is not enough to get the goods from this amp. Putting the master volume as POST phase inverter, we still get that goodness from the phase inverter being overdriven by the preamp, and the sound is closer to stock.....just at a lower volume.

[rayc]

The "natural state" is a thing of beauty.
Post AND Pre are cool as well but very different, as you wrote.
All sound rather better than my beast - but I have a daggy Marshal cab/speaker arrangement so may have to look at buying a decent speaker for the preferred mic position in the cabinet.
I'm still working with the "darkness" problem of my gear. Sounds loud n bright in the room but not nearly as bright in the box.
I've started tinkering with mic placement again.
After I finish my current work stint I'll see about opening the Superbass and taking photos so I can track the changes made.
Thanks Greg - excellent learning experience.

[Minerman]

@rayc and anyone else that might give shit.

This is the difference between PRE phase inverter master volume, and POST phase inverter master volume on Plexi/Bassman type amps that don't have their own master volumes.

Gibson Les Paul Traditional - Muttbucker PAF bridge
Marshall 1987 50w Plexi
Presence - 4
Bass - 5
Mid - 6
Treb - 4
Bright channel 1 vol - 5
High input only
Marshall 1960B 4x12 - Celestion G12-65
MXL R144 on axis, 3" off grill, dead center - Shure SM57 on axis, 3" off grill, just outside dustcap
50/50 mic blend
No FX or EQ

First up, the amp in it's natural state. No master volume.
1987 full.mp3


Turned down 50% with POST phase inverter master volume.
1987 POST PIMV 50%.mp3


Turned down 50% with PRE phase inverter master volume
1987 PRE PIMV 50%.mp3


This is without adjusting the mic preamps. Full loud is the baseline, and the others are relative to full loud. As you can tell, the amount of volume reduction between pre and post master volumes is different. And so is what it does to the tone. By cutting the signal before the phase inverter, it loses a lot of grind. The phase inverter, as part of the power section, obviously plays a big part in the tone. If I cut it back even further/quieter, the tone thins out even more. The preamp section alone is not enough to get the goods from this amp. Putting the master volume as POST phase inverter, we still get that goodness from the phase inverter being overdriven by the preamp, and the sound is closer to stock.....just at a lower volume.

No question POST pimv is the way to go dude, that's just a great sound man...Old school Marshall all the way...

[Greg_L]

The "natural state" is a thing of beauty.
Post AND Pre are cool as well but very different, as you wrote.
All sound rather better than my beast - but I have a daggy Marshal cab/speaker arrangement so may have to look at buying a decent speaker for the preferred mic position in the cabinet.
I'm still working with the "darkness" problem of my gear. Sounds loud n bright in the room but not nearly as bright in the box.
I've started tinkering with mic placement again.
After I finish my current work stint I'll see about opening the Superbass and taking photos so I can track the changes made.
Thanks Greg - excellent learning experience.

Man I really wish we lived on the same planet. If there was an easy way for you to get that amp to me I'd fix it up myself.

[TripleM]

@rayc and anyone else that might give shit.

This is the difference between PRE phase inverter master volume, and POST phase inverter master volume on Plexi/Bassman type amps that don't have their own master volumes.

Gibson Les Paul Traditional - Muttbucker PAF bridge
Marshall 1987 50w Plexi
Presence - 4
Bass - 5
Mid - 6
Treb - 4
Bright channel 1 vol - 5
High input only
Marshall 1960B 4x12 - Celestion G12-65
MXL R144 on axis, 3" off grill, dead center - Shure SM57 on axis, 3" off grill, just outside dustcap
50/50 mic blend
No FX or EQ

First up, the amp in it's natural state. No master volume.
1987 full.mp3


Turned down 50% with POST phase inverter master volume.
1987 POST PIMV 50%.mp3


Turned down 50% with PRE phase inverter master volume
1987 PRE PIMV 50%.mp3


This is without adjusting the mic preamps. Full loud is the baseline, and the others are relative to full loud. As you can tell, the amount of volume reduction between pre and post master volumes is different. And so is what it does to the tone. By cutting the signal before the phase inverter, it loses a lot of grind. The phase inverter, as part of the power section, obviously plays a big part in the tone. If I cut it back even further/quieter, the tone thins out even more. The preamp section alone is not enough to get the goods from this amp. Putting the master volume as POST phase inverter, we still get that goodness from the phase inverter being overdriven by the preamp, and the sound is closer to stock.....just at a lower volume.

Geez a huge difference in those samples. The POST sound is very cool. Probably my favorite.

[Greg_L]

No question POST pimv is the way to go dude, that's just a great sound man...Old school Marshall all the way...

Geez a huge difference in those samples. The POST sound is very cool. Probably my favorite.

Right, thanks dudes. The POST version is indeed the way to go with an amp like this...or any amp with channel volumes but no actual master volume. And old Fender, old Marshall, old Ampeg, whatever. No master volume? No problem. The POST PIMV is a simple mod and it allows the amp to be usable at home or on a stage. This amp in it's natural state is just way too loud to be used anywhere but the studio. This "little" 50 watt amp will completely drown out even the loudest drummer and the rest of the band. Modern sound guys in modern venues cannot mix this amp.

But as I mentioned HERE, there is a case for the PRE PIMV. The PRE PIMV is the most common type of master volume used in amps today. This amp can be in it's natural Plexi state, and I modded it so the gain stages can be cascaded like a JCM 800. The latter is where the PRE PIMV master works better IMO. That's why this amp has two master volumes. It's two amps in one, and they need different types of master volumes. I'll do cascaded master volume clips later.