The Tone Thread

[Minerman]

Well, I thought I had to see the doc today, but it's tomorrow...Dunno wtf I was thinking, but anyway...

Here are a few more clips, but I can already tell you what most of you will say, they're overly bright...I got carried away with the treble knob...I did use the attenuator, & it's volume was full on, but I think it still affected the tone a little...I'll re-amp these di's & post the results after fiddling with them for a while...

I got carried away with the gain too, but in my own defense I wasn't trying to nail these tones, I'm just having fun with my new toy...So far I'm lovin' this little amp...

Signal chain: SG > Mini 800 > Greenback > SM57

20w mode w/attenuator full
Presence:4
Bass:6
Middle:3
Treble:8
Master:8
Gain:10

SG_Mini 800_Greenback_57_ 10-7-2019.mp3

Signal chain: Strat bridge HB > Mini 800 > V30 > SM57

20w mode w/attenuator full
Presence:4
Bass:6
Middle:3
Treble:8
Master:8
Gain:10

Strat_Mini 800_V30_57_ 10-7-2019.mp3

Shitty playing & mix clip:

Mini 800_Hell Ain't A Bad Place To Be _MIX_ 10-7-2019.mp3

[Greg_L]

Those sound pretty good [mention]Minerman[/mention] . I like the V30 better though. The Greenback clip is a little flubby to me. For me, on 2203s/2204s, when the gain goes up, the bass gotta come down. That's the bright cap in action. When you get the preamp up around 7-ish, the bright cap gets bypassed and things can get flubby if you have the bass too high.



Here's your reamp on a 2203 with everything at "5". G12H30 + 57 dustcap/cone seam, little more outside.

miner's reamp.mp3

I used your DI just as it is. It's a little weak so it's not pushing the amp hard at all. I don't know where your pickups hit your meters when you go straight DI so I just left it as it is. And wtf, why is it a stereo DI? Lol. Not necessary.

[Minerman]

Those sound pretty good Minerman . I like the V30 better though. The Greenback clip is a little flubby to me. For me, on 2203s/2204s, when the gain goes up, the bass gotta come down. That's the bright cap in action. When you get the preamp up around 7-ish, the bright cap gets bypassed and things can get flubby if you have the bass too high.



Here's your reamp on a 2203 with everything at "5". G12H30 + 57 dustcap/cone seam, little more outside.
miner's reamp.mp3

I used your DI just as it is. It's a little weak so it's not pushing the amp hard at all. I don't know where your pickups hit your meters when you go straight DI so I just left it as it is. And wtf, why is it a stereo DI? Lol. Not necessary.

Ok dude, thanks for the heads up on the bright cap, for some reason I thought the bright cap was on the master volume...

[mention]Greg_L[/mention] You didn't think the last set of clips were too bright??? Lemme know...

When I rendered that di, I didn't even think about it doing stereo, my bad...But, there's something not right with it too, I'm gonna have to check that project to see what I fucked up...

More to come...

[Greg_L]

@Greg_L You didn't think the last set of clips were too bright??? Lemme know...

No way, not too bright

[Minerman]

@Greg_L You didn't think the last set of clips were too bright??? Lemme know...

No way, not too bright

Ok dude that gives me a little more confidence...I've been known to go way overboard especially on the high end, so...

[Greg_L]

Ok dude that gives me a little more confidence...I've been known to go way overboard especially on the high end, so...

Did you listen to your DI through my amp?

[Minerman]

Ok dude that gives me a little more confidence...I've been known to go way overboard especially on the high end, so...

Did you listen to your DI through my amp?

Yes the high end on your track sounds fine, but it sounds very different than it should, but that's definitely my fault...I re-amp as I go (I always record a di), & I use folders for my guitars...I disable the master/parent send so I don't hear the di when I record...I forgot to enable the send, & while the di did come through the folder track, it was much weaker than it should've been...My bad...

But, I'm trying to redeem myself, I've got you a couple more di's to run through your amp if you wanna...

[Greg_L]

Yes the high end on your track sounds fine, but it sounds very different than it should, but that's definitely my fault...I re-amp as I go (I always record a di), & I use folders for my guitars...I disable the master/parent send so I don't hear the di when I record...I forgot to enable the send, & while the di did come through the folder track, it was much weaker than it should've been...My bad...

But, I'm trying to redeem myself, I've got you a couple more di's to run through your amp if you wanna...

Sure.

If I normalize your DI to where I think it should be it'll definitely push the amp more.

[Minerman]

Ok, here are some more clips & I think they're an improvement from the last round, so I'm curious to hear what you guys think...

I learned something about this amp today, it sounds much, much better without the attenuator, it's almost like night & day, so I didn't use it for these clips...

The 5w clips are a lot quieter here compared to how it sounds in the room...Using the peak meters in the daw, I usually try to hit around -12db or so & I used that to guess-ti-mate there's about a 3db difference between the 20w/5w setting...


Signal Chain: Strat HB bridge > Mini JCM 800 > Greenback > SM57

The first clip is 5w mode, & the 2nd is 20w mode

• Presence:............5
  Bass:.................5.5
  Middle:................4
  Treble:...............6.5
  Master:...............2
  Gain:..................7

Strat _ Mini 800 5 W _ Greenback _ SM57 10-7-2019.mp3

Strat _ Mini 800 20 W _ Greenback _ SM57 10-7-2019.mp3

Signal Chain: SG > Mini JCM 800 > Greenback > SM57

The first clip is 5w mode, & the 2nd is 20w mode

• Presence:............5
  Bass:.................5.5
  Middle:................4
  Treble:...............6.5
  Master:...............2
  Gain:..................7

SG _ Mini 800 5 W _ Greenback _ SM57 10-7-2019.mp3

SG _ Mini 800 20 W _ Greenback _ SM57 10-7-2019.mp3

[mention]Greg_L[/mention] here are some better di's dude...

DI's for Greg.rar

[Minerman]

I'm trying to redeem myself, I've got you a couple more di's to run through your amp if you wanna...

Sure.

If I normalize your DI to where I think it should be it'll definitely push the amp more.

[mention]Greg_L[/mention]
Try these in your daw without doing anything to 'em & see if they're any better...Thanks man!!!!!!



And an update concerning my pedals...The MXR power brick took care of the noise I was having with the 1Spot, so I'm a happy camper...Plus, I'm still waiting on the TC Electronic univibe too, it's supposed to be here Wednesday...

[Greg_L]

[mention]Minerman[/mention]

Okay well 20w mode murders 5w mode. 5w sounds pretty small and weak. 20w sounds pretty much like it should. Stick with 20! Sounds nice.

[Minerman]

@Minerman

Okay well 20w mode murders 5w mode. 5w sounds pretty small and weak. 20w sounds pretty much like it should. Stick with 20! Sounds nice.

I concur dude...So far that's the only negative thing about this amp...Not really much of a volume drop, but that's ok too...I'm still really, really happy with it, & I think that it actually sounds really similar to it's big brothers, maybe not 100%, but close enough...

You did see where the volume was set for those clips didn't you??? It was on "2"...

[Greg_L]

I concur dude...So far that's the only negative thing about this amp...Not really much of a volume drop, but that's ok too...I'm still really, really happy with it, & I think that it actually sounds really similar to it's big brothers, maybe not 100%, but close enough...

You did see where the volume was set for those clips didn't you??? It was on "2"...

Yeah. Find where the power section starts working and it'll be even better.

A JCM 800 on 3-4 is okay. A JCM 800 after 5 is another dimension of bad ass.

[Minerman]

Yeah. Find where the power section starts working and it'll be even better.

A JCM 800 on 3-4 is okay. A JCM 800 after 5 is another dimension of bad ass.

When all is said & done, as loud as this amp is, I could've gotten a "real" JCM 800 for about the same or maybe a little more $$$, but for my needs this is fine...

I'm still shocked at how good it sounds in the room, that's hard to capture in a recording...I've still gotta learn how it behaves, so there's a lot more experimenting to do yet...That's what's fun for me is piddling finding different kinds of tones...

BTW, I ran the SD-1/TS9 through it this evening & it sounded great with both...

I forgot to mention I have my "Bastard" cab wired up as 2 - 2x12's...The Greenback/65 on one side & the V30/G12H on the other...So the amp is only pushing 2 speakers at a time...I dunno if that makes any difference, just guessing I'd say not...

[TripleM]

Ok, here's the first clip(s) with the Mini JCM 800...

They all sounded great. My favorite was the Attenuator DI no cab sim clip.

[JD01]

[mention]Minerman[/mention] I just listened to your 5W and 20W comparison.
I thought the 5W clips sounded pretty good until I heard the 20W clips - when comparing the back to back 20W mode sound huge.

By way of experiment - why not turn the amp up much louder on 5W mode until you get to a similar perceived volume in the room. Hopefully that will make the 5W mode sound similarly big (or bigger) as you should be getting the power section working even harder to achieve the volume.

Not sure how the selector works on this amp and if there's any sort of built in attenuation though.

[Greg_L]

[mention]Minerman[/mention] Here's your DIs reamped with your same settings.

miner all 5s G12H30 57.mp3

miner SG Greenback 57.mp3

miner Strat Greenback 57.mp3

[Minerman]

They all sounded great. My favorite was the Attenuator DI no cab sim clip.

Thanks TripM, but the clips without any cab sim are terrible IMO...I uploaded those so Greg (or anyone else) could re-amp 'em to compare my little 20w toy JCM 800 to his Bad Ass Real Deal JCM 800(s)...But, if you like 'em that's cool too dude...

Post us some clips of your tones man, everyone & every type/style of music are more than welcome...You mentioned re-tracking some things for the songs you sent me, this thread is a really good way to get feedback/opinions, plus we can all learn things...
Jump in dude...

Minerman I just listened to your 5W and 20W comparison.
I thought the 5W clips sounded pretty good until I heard the 20W clips - when comparing the back to back 20W mode sound huge.

Thanks Jdude...The 20w mode kills the 5w mode, hands down, stomps it's guts out, but, the 5w setting doesn't sound bad to me, just different...It's a little more compressed & the 20w mode is more open, for lack of better description...

By way of experiment - why not turn the amp up much louder on 5W mode until you get to a similar perceived volume in the room. Hopefully that will make the 5W mode sound similarly big (or bigger) as you should be getting the power section working even harder to achieve the volume.

Just to be totally honest, there isn't very much difference, loudness/noise wise, to my ears anyway...I'll try your suggestion & post the results dude, I'll just have to fiddle with it until I learn how it responds a little better...

Not sure how the selector works on this amp and if there's any sort of built in attenuation though.

This amp is just like the other 20/5w Mini Marshall amps (Mini Jubilee, Mini Plexi Mini DSL), you use the standby switch to use either the 5w or 20w setting...It's kinda like the power scaling thing in a way, somehow they've managed to manipulate the voltage going into the power tubes, which drops the output...That's the hillbilly explanation anyway...

[Minerman]

Minerman Here's your DIs reamped with your same settings.

Thanks Greg...From the comparisons we've done so far, I'm about positive this amp has more pre-amp gain than yours...But, with your amp's master volume on "2" it might not be pushed quite enough to get it where it needs to be, maybe...

I think overall, it's voiced & sounds very similar to the real deal, but of course it ain't 100%/spot on, simply because it just can't...Smaller iron plus whatever's different in the circuit to make it a 20w amp just won't allow it...But I think it's a great little amp, & for me, it's close enough from the comparison clips we've posted...I've drove myself bat-shit crazy wondering how the 20w stacks up against it's big brothers, but I can put that to rest now...

It's kinda hard for me to believe, but I've finally got myself a JCM 800...

Sometimes I honestly don't know how to act because of all the bad shit that kicked me in the teeth for so long, but life is actually pretty fuckin' good for me at the moment...
'Ol Miner is one happy hillbilly right now...

[Greg_L]

Thanks Greg...From the comparisons we've done so far, I'm about positive this amp has more pre-amp gain than yours...But, with your amp's master volume on "2" it might not be pushed quite enough to get it where it needs to be, maybe...

I think overall, it's voiced & sounds very similar to the real deal, but of course it ain't 100%/spot on, simply because it just can't...Smaller iron plus whatever's different in the circuit to make it a 20w amp just won't allow it...But I think it's a great little amp, & for me, it's close enough from the comparison clips we've posted...I've drove myself bat-shit crazy wondering how the 20w stacks up against it's big brothers, but I can put that to rest now...

It's kinda hard for me to believe, but I've finally got myself a JCM 800...

Sometimes I honestly don't know how to act because of all the bad shit that kicked me in the teeth for so long, but life is actually pretty fuckin' good for me at the moment...
'Ol Miner is one happy hillbilly right now...

Ha cool.

My amp on 2 is not happy. It's too loud to sit in front of and noodle around, but it's not loud enough for the amp to be what it is. I'd bet that your new 20w version is designed to be more linear and usable at lower volumes, even though 20 watts has plenty of potential to be loud. That might be why it has more preamp gain. The whole point of preamp gain in this circuit is to make up for what the power amp is lacking at low volumes. If your amp was intended to be more usable at lower volumes, it makes sense that they'd design it to have more preamp gain.