The Tone Thread

[Greg_L]

Here's something I've been working on, long way from being finished, just wondering what you guys think of it...Both guitars have just a hair of eq & a little reverb on 'em...

Signal chain:
SG > Mini Jube > ISO cab Greenback > i5

Both guitars have the same amp settings except the right side is the lead channel & the left is the rhythm clip, all I did was switch channels...

• 5w mode
  Presence: 5
  Bass: 8
  Mid: 7.5
  Treble: 3
  Output Master: 7
  Lead Master: 7
  Input Gain: 5

I think that sounds good. Nice tones, very AC/DC-ish.

[Greg_L]

How's my tone guys?

Remember miro raving on about his Carol Ann amp that he got from somewhere? Well I found that the Kemper has a "Carolyn Anne" profile done by the #1 pro profiler dude, which can only be that amp (they never copy the exact name for reasons of legality, I guess, so you always have to decode), so I've fired it up, and done a bit of tinkering with it while the tele is plugged in, and recorded a "thing" I've been working up for a while.

I seem to be moving ever closer to a power trio - it's that guitar, I swear it.

Anyway, I've put some tremolo and reverb on the sound, added some basic drums and bass and had a rough (comped) stab at it. I'll definitely re-record it because I haven't worked out the final structure yet, but thought I'd check the basic sound via the panel here before I go any further. Plus I have another song to finish first anyway.

Any thoughts? (It's about 2 minutes but there's a different section after the second "chorus" which I wanted to include, so bear with it)

New project 14.mp3


And just the guitar

New project 14 - Guitar only.mp3

That amp profile works well with a Tele. That's a really good Tele crunch tone. Nice find on that profile. The stereo tremolo is way too much. Tremolo kicks ass, but keep it mono and keep us from being nauseated.

[Minerman]

I think that sounds good. Nice tones, very AC/DC-ish.

Thanks dude, I have a question for ya...

I know the JCM800 & Jubilee are very different amps, but what is the biggest factor in the differences in your opinion??? Is it the tone stack that's voiced differently, added gain, combination of those things or what???

[Greg_L]

Thanks dude, I have a question for ya...

I know the JCM800 & Jubilee are very different amps, but what is the biggest factor in the differences in your opinion??? Is it the tone stack that's voiced differently, added gain, combination of those things or what???

It's everything. The Jubilee is a weird amp. No other Marshalls act or sound like the Jubilee. I don't know the Jubilee circuit well enough to narrow down the technical differences, so I can only go on the sound. I'm pretty sure the Jube uses LEDs for the lead channel and diode clippers for the rhythm clip in the preamp, and those added signal clippers makes the Jubilee sound IMO like it has a permanent boost pedal engaged. That's not a bad thing if you want that kind of sound, but it's something that can't easily be "dialed out". The "800", or more specifically, the 2203/2204, has none of that stuff and it's pure signal all the way through. The 2203 sounds a lot more open and less compressed, but with only a little less preamp gain. The 2203's tone controls are more interactive and less obtrusive. On a 2203, the bass affects the mids, the mids affect the treble, they all sort of overlap and play off of each other. One tweak affects the other controls. Add mids, reduce treble, it all kind of yields the same thing. On a Jubilee, it all seems to really be focused on the mid control. I've always felt that a Jubilee could just have one tone knob - the mid control - and that's all you need with that amp. It overrides everything. Bass and treble are basically just there to fill up the front panel.

So in a nutshell, I've always felt that a Jubilee sounds like a JCM 800 with a Tube Screamer in front and the mids cranked to 10. I could set my 800 like that and get a pretty close Jubilee sound. But that was the initial idea of the Jubilee and why people like them - they have that sort of boosted 800 kind of sound that was popular in the 80s. They're great for cutting leads, kind of flat and uninspiring for rhythm playing IMO. Where a stock 800 is more natural and open, more like the "Back in Black" sound.

[Minerman]

The Jubilee is a weird amp. No other Marshalls act or sound like the Jubilee. I don't know the Jubilee circuit well enough to narrow down the technical differences, so I can only go on the sound. I'm pretty sure the Jube uses LEDs for the lead channel and diode clippers for the rhythm clip in the preamp, and those added signal clippers makes the Jubilee sound IMO like it has a permanent boost pedal engaged. That's not a bad thing if you want that kind of sound, but it's something that can't easily be "dialed out". The "800", or more specifically, the 2203/2204, has none of that stuff and it's pure signal all the way through. The 2203 sounds a lot more open and less compressed, but with only a little less preamp gain. The 2203's tone controls are more interactive and less obtrusive. On a 2203, the bass affects the mids, the mids affect the treble, they all sort of overlap and play off of each other. One tweak affects the other controls. Add mids, reduce treble, it all kind of yields the same thing. On a Jubilee, it all seems to really be focused on the mid control. I've always felt that a Jubilee could just have one tone knob - the mid control - and that's all you need with that amp. It overrides everything. Bass and treble are basically just there to fill up the front panel.

So in a nutshell, I've always felt that a Jubilee sounds like a JCM 800 with a Tube Screamer in front and the mids cranked to 10. I could set my 800 like that and get a pretty close Jubilee sound. But that was the initial idea of the Jubilee and why people like them - they have that sort of boosted 800 kind of sound that was popular in the 80s. They're great for cutting leads, kind of flat and uninspiring for rhythm playing IMO. Where a stock 800 is more natural and open, more like the "Back in Black" sound.

Thanks man, your description of the Jubilee fits my 2525H to a "T"...On my amp, the mid knob does absolutely nothing until you get to around "6" or so, & the bass/treble/presence are all kinda interacted with each other...My amp can be very bright too, turn either the treble or presence knob all the way off, then use the other for the high end...The bass knob is kinda like the mid, but it changes the tone a little more, but not much...

You're right, it is a weird amp, but I've found some pretty usable tones lately by rolling everything back quite a bit...I did play through this thing before I bought it, but it's still nothing like I expected, again, it's weird...

I can get a kinda "Angus-y" tone with the SG/Greenback by setting it like this:

• Presence : 0
  Bass: 6-7-ish
  Mid: 5-ish
  Treble: 5-ish
  Output Master: 7-ish
  Lead Master: 7-ish
  Input Gain: Usually around 4, depending if it's for a lead or rhythm tone, obviously a little more gain for lead...

I've also found some variations of a similar tone with the rhythm clip engaged on the clean channel...

It's took me a while, but I've finally got my head around setting this thing up for a 70-ish guitar tone, but the settings are nothing like I would have expected them to be...

Ever since I got this thing, I'd wondered how the tonestack values & circuitry differed from an 800, so thanks again dude...

[Minerman]

Ok dudes, here's the moment of truth to find out what all you Tone-tards think of my newest tone...I'm more than impressed with Mutt's p'ups, they kick ass...Both p'ups are great for the dirty tones I usually do, but the coil split caught me off guard & is a great addition to my little arsenal...

It's still got the "Fender" thing with the twangy top end sorta like SRV or similar, that goes from clean to mean...Both p'ups respond really well rolling the volume off too...In short, these p'ups far exceeded my expectations...I knew they'd sound good with a lot of gain like I normally use, but again, the coil split is really something else...

I'm not good at describing sounds, but this guitar now sounds like a hot-rodded, pissed off telecaster to me...
I fuckin' love it so far, & I still have to dial it in a bit more...

All the guitars are the strat with the exact same amp settings, speaker & mic...I used the rhythm clip for the rhythm guitars, the lead channel for the lead & slide guitars...

There is some reverb on all the guitars in the mix, but no other fx were used...The individual clips are completely dry...

Rhythm Guitars: Bridge p'up, coil split
Slide Guitar: Neck p'up, humbucker
Lead Guitar: Bridge p'up, humbucker

Strat> Mini Jube > Greenback > 57

• 5w mode
  
  Presence: 0
  Bass: 6
  Mid: 6.5
  Treble: 5
  Output Master: 5
  Lead Master: 8
  Input Gain: 7

I was very worried about my installation work, & I only had to fix one wrong connection, but so far it seems like it's good...I must've done ok with the grounding, as it's pretty quiet, even in coil split mode for either p'up...

I'm very curious to find out what you guys think of these tones...

[Greg_L]

Goddamn miner, that sounds pretty great to me. That lead tone is terrific and perfect for your style. It has that stringy super strat sound down cold. Very very good.

[Minerman]

Goddamn miner, that sounds pretty great to me. That lead tone is terrific and perfect for your style. It has that stringy super strat sound down cold. Very very good.

Thanks Greg...
Man, I just cannot believe what a difference those p'ups made, it really is like getting a new guitar...

Dunno if you understand what I'm talking about, but it's got that snarling, biting top end like SRV had...It's not harsh & you can't dial it out/get rid of it, that's the "Fender" thing to me, but it's got all kinds of ass/bottom/chunk too...Again, I just cannot believe how good this thing sounds man...

I'll go ahead & let my little secret out, I was hoping this would get me closer to a Malcolm-ish tone because I saw a guy on YT using a tele that sounded pretty close...That was where I got the idea for the lower output p'ups...

I can't believe how versatile these things are either man, it can go from Johnny Cash clean/country twang, to Rolling Stones-ish slightly dirty to full blown 80's hair metal...

So, this guitar will definitely sound different from my others in a mix, & will do a great job while doing it...Again, I just cannot believe how this thing sounds now...

[Greg_L]

Thanks Greg...
Man, I just cannot believe what a difference those p'ups made, it really is like getting a new guitar...

Dunno if you understand what I'm talking about, but it's got that snarling, biting top end like SRV had...It's not harsh & you can't dial it out/get rid of it, that's the "Fender" thing to me, but it's got all kinds of ass/bottom/chunk too...Again, I just cannot believe how good this thing sounds man...

I'll go ahead & let my little secret out, I was hoping this would get me closer to a Malcolm-ish tone because I saw a guy on YT using a tele that sounded pretty close...That was where I got the idea for the lower output p'ups...

I can't believe how versatile these things are either man, it can go from Johnny Cash clean/country twang, to Rolling Stones-ish slightly dirty to full blown 80's hair metal...

So, this guitar will definitely sound different from my others in a mix, & will do a great job while doing it...Again, I just cannot believe how this thing sounds now...

I totally get it dude. It has hints of that EVH style sound too. That's gonna be a good guitar for you.

[Minerman]

I totally get it dude. It has hints of that EVH style sound too. That's gonna be a good guitar for you.

Don't know if I'd told you guys this or not, but that guitar had been in it's case for almost 4 years now...
It didn't even have strings on it all that time...

The last little while I've learned how to dial the Mini Jubilee in a little better...I'm really happy with that amp, the strat clips were recorded in low power mode with the ISO cab & the noise level was about like an old person's loud tv in the next room...

I still can't get over those p'ups, this originally started as p'ups for the SG...Over time, it's became my main guitar & I probably ain't gonna do anything to it, it's perfect to me, but damn if the strat doesn't kick some ass now...

[JD01]

Sounds excellent, miner. Nothing wrong with that at all!

[rayc]

MM,
it sounds like a bought one - very cool and it also sounds like you were having fun playing. Nice playing by the way.

[muttley]

It aint just the pups miner, there is some cool playing and thought gonna into those tones. Sounds pretty fuckin' awesome to me... Looking forward to hearing more of them in the future. Glad you like em..

[Minerman]

Ok dudes, here's one of the clips I made for Mutt, I'm assuming he'll put it on his website when he gets it all fixed up...I swear this "new" strat is fuckin' killer, I've never had a guitar that sounds like this...My playing is a little sloppy, so overlook it...


Signal chain:
MIM Strat > Mini Jubilee > ISO Cab w/Greenback > SM57

I used the bridge pickup split during the rhythm parts (before & after the solo)...The first half of the solo is the bridge humbucker, then the neck humbucker for the 2nd half of the solo...

Mini Jubilee settings:

• 5w mode
  Presence: 0
  Bass: 5
  Mid: 6.5
  Treble: 3
  Output Master: 7-8
  Lead Master: 5
  Input Gain: 7

Obviously there are effects on the guitar, but most of you know I like effects...

Mutt P'ups Floyd Mix 4-22-2018.mp3

I'm curious to what you guys think about this clip, so lemme know...

More to come...

[Bubba]

Ha ha, that sounded really good, Miner. One of my favourite guitar solos, done in your own way. It's a really clear mix too, and the guitar sounds great.

[rayc]

That solo really cuts through the mix - nice settings, nice pup tone and cool playing Miner.
Songs for bongs?

[muttley]

To save me guessing miner? Which pup where an any splits?

You've made a Gilmour tune sound real which is more than he can do most of the time...

[JD01]

Miner, this sounds excellent. Both the tones and the mix.

[musicturtle]

Man that sounds great Minerman. I agree with above I like the way you made the solo your own and the tone is just excellent to me.

[Minerman]

Thanks guys, I'm really diggin' these pickups, they've gave new life to that guitar...

To save me guessing miner? Which pup where an any splits?

Sorry Mutt, I meant to put that info in there, but it totally slipped my mind...

I used the bridge pickup split during the rhythm parts (before & after the solo)...The first half of the solo is the bridge humbucker, then the neck humbucker for the 2nd half of the solo...

I edited my post so it'll all be in one place too...