The Tone Thread

[Greg_L]

AND AGAIN,
Here's a sample of my modded amp.
I popped the cab up on a crate.
57 at edge of dust cap & coil but about 10" away (in phase) with 609 placed as if it was beside the 57.
I recorded a simple chord progression, (3 or 4 chords in F shape) into a looper.
I did tune the guitar thrice prior to doing the loop.
Presence - 5
Bass - 5
Mids - 6
Treble - 5.5
MV - 2
Input I Vol 2 then 5 then 8 then max
Input II Vol 2 then 5 then 8 then max
then
MV5
Input I Vol 2 then 5 then 8 then max
Input II Vol 2 then 5 then 8 then max
Modded Marshall V7.mp3
I've not yet contacted the tech with the question as it was a long weekend Downunder
I'll ask later this week after I've confirmed he's at work.
I'll also have to read about/experiment regarding MV versus V I suppose.

I think it sounds pretty good. The boom JD mentioned is probably just the distance of the mics from the cabs. 10" is enough to get room reflections in there.

Your channel 1 is definitely not getting dirty enough. I hate being the bearer of bad news but your tech did not do a complete job on that conversion. Ch 1 on 10 should be like Jimi Hendrix sounding meltdown.

[Minerman]

Ray: I think you're finding your zone dude, I hear improvement with each clip you post, just keep at it...
BTW, I've been meaning to ask what speaker/cab are you using with the big Marshall???

No I don't have access to that original Jubilee anymore. The guy sold it. Actually, he had two of them and sold both of them. This is a different guy and a reissue. But I know for an indisputable fact that the original Jubilees are not blacked out and computerized like the new ones. And frankly, I think this reissue sounds better than those originals did - when it works.

Ok, I get my wires crossed pretty easy on shit like that...Not hard for me to do btw...

I like my mini Jubilee more every time I play through it, it's a great little amp to me...I'm still fucking with the comparison clips, I've got about 10 or so of your clips & I've been using an eq spectrum plugin comparing my amp with your clips...It probably won't help make my little amp sound any closer to an 800, but I like doing shit like that...I've did the same thing with ampsims & it helped me to get a handle on where I was off or missing something, so it's a way to learn, & again, I like doing shit like that too...

[Greg_L]

If there was a way to decompress the Jubilee, it could sound a lot like the 800. All those clippers literally clip the signal.

[Minerman]

If there was a way to decompress the Jubilee, it could sound a lot like the 800. All those clippers literally clip the signal.

I agree man, the bottom is fatter sounding too...This may sound crazy, but it sounds more 800-ish on the clean channel with the clip engaged, using the SD-1 as a clean boost, with the master up & the gain kinda low, around 4-5, then start with the bass knob on about 5 or so...

It's got a lot of low end & the SD-1 thins it out a bit...Getting the master volume up helps too...Like everything else, I stumbled onto this a few days ago...When I switched from the Ibby to the SG making the last clip I posted it caught my attention...Not sure how to describe it, but the Ibanez was kinda "buzzy" sounding...Not fizzy or like a jar of bees, it's hard to describe...The SG/LP are obviously not as hot, but that Duncan p'up is just very different IMO...

[Greg_L]

Here ya go miner, compare this to your Jube rhythm clip. I think this is a pretty good representation of my 2203 not set to total meltdown. I like this sound and it's one I use with the amp all the time.

Les Paul Traditional - Burstbucker 3 bridge pickup
JCM 800 2203
Presence - 4
Bass - 5.5
Mid - 7
Treb - 7
Master vol - 4.5
Preamp vol - 5.5
Marshall 1960B 4x12 Celestion Vintage 30
Senn MD421 on axis, on grill, dustcap/cone - Shure SM57 off axis, on grill, middle cone
Equal blend 50/50
No FX or EQ

LP800V30.mp3

[Lt. Bob]

Bob: I've thought about asking if you would sell the 6100 man, once it got here it wouldn't be moved much...But, if you're that convinced it'd take another crap, I dunno...Just curious, what would you want for that thing???

I'd absolutely sell it .... I dunno ..... 400 bucks matbe.

Problem is that the connectors lose connection.
Fixing it is mearly a matter of taking it apart and unplugging and reconnecting all the many connectors throughout the amp.
It works fine after that.
In any other amp it's be a piece of cake but this one's a pain.
I may see about replacing all the connectors with actual hand soldered wires ..... then it'd be fixed ..... then I might not sell it.

But I can't imagine it gets thru shipping and still works.

[Greg_L]

I'd absolutely sell it .... I dunno ..... 400 bucks matbe.

Problem is that the connectors lose connection.
Fixing it is mearly a matter of taking it apart and unplugging and reconnecting all the many connectors throughout the amp.
It works fine after that.
In any other amp it's be a piece of cake but this one's a pain.
I may see about replacing all the connectors with actual hand soldered wires ..... then it'd be fixed ..... then I might not sell it.

But I can't imagine it gets thru shipping and still works.

This would probably be a full day's pain in the ass, but you could go through and tighten up all the sockets in all those connectors.

[Minerman]

I'd absolutely sell it .... I dunno ..... 400 bucks matbe.

Problem is that the connectors lose connection.
Fixing it is mearly a matter of taking it apart and unplugging and reconnecting all the many connectors throughout the amp.
It works fine after that.
In any other amp it's be a piece of cake but this one's a pain.
I may see about replacing all the connectors with actual hand soldered wires ..... then it'd be fixed ..... then I might not sell it.

But I can't imagine it gets thru shipping and still works.

Ok man...You all know I'm a big Marshall fanboy, & I'm always interested in one of their amps so lemme ponder on it for a little while, & maybe we can work it out dude...

The banging around being shipped was a concern before you mentioned it, so again, lemme ponder on it...

By all means if someone throws the cash your way don't wait on me Bob, but again, maybe we can work it out...

This would probably be a full day's pain in the ass, but you could go through and tighten up all the sockets in all those connectors.

After he told me basically what the prognosis is that thought crossed my mind too...I could probably handle that as long as I took my time with everything, & like I mentioned, once it got here, it wouldn't be moved around very little, if much at all...

[Minerman]

BTW, the volume/bass drop thing we've been talking about in the Jubilee amps, I gotta hand it to Amplitube on their modeling...Just fucking around, I loaded that ampsim up, & it does the same thing my real amp does...It's a bit more subtle, but it's there...

[rayc]

JCM 800 2203
Presence - 4
Bass - 5.5
Mid - 7
Treb - 7
Master vol - 4.5
Preamp vol - 5.5
Marshall 1960B 4x12 Celestion Vintage 30
Senn MD421 on axis, on grill, dustcap/cone - Shure SM57 off axis, on grill, middle cone

Greg,
That rocks - there's a LOT of tone in your fingers though.
I'll replicate the settings and sub my 609 for the 421.
I'm experimenting with settings so this will be an interesting starting point.

[Greg_L]

Greg,
That rocks - there's a LOT of tone in your fingers though.
I'll replicate the settings and sub my 609 for the 421.
I'm experimenting with settings so this will be an interesting starting point.

Thanks Ray. Keep in mind...this is a JCM 800. With all things being the same, the 800 has more gain than a Super Lead. But yeah give it a try.

I'm gonna do some Plexi clips tomorrow with your settings so you can see how they compare.

[rayc]

Greg,
I'm looking starting points for settings - MV:V as well as the tone group.
I ought to experiment and decide what my ears tell me is good but you know, as well as I do, that my ears aren't critical enough.
I look forward to a Plexi sample for comparison and any reccos that come with it.

[Greg_L]

Greg,
I'm looking starting points for settings - MV:V as well as the tone group.
I ought to experiment and decide what my ears tell me is good but you know, as well as I do, that my ears aren't critical enough.
I look forward to a Plexi sample for comparison and any reccos that come with it.

I can tell you this about the Plexi tone stack - it usually sounds good no matter what you do with it. I'm not sure why that is. Some amps have a tiny little range of usable EQ settings and that's about all it can do. Plexi type amps are different. You can turn those knobs any which way and extreme things will happen, but it's never extreme in a really bad way. The EQ controls are very interactive with each other. You can kind of approximate a Fender Bassman with a Plexi by diming the bass and treble and put the mids on 0. On most amps that would sound like hammered dogshit, but on a Plexi it's pretty bad ass.

[rayc]

I can tell you this about the Plexi tone stack - it usually sounds good no matter what you do with it. I'm not sure why that is. Some amps have a tiny little range of usable EQ settings and that's about all it can do. Plexi type amps are different. You can turn those knobs any which way and extreme things will happen, but it's never extreme in a really bad way. The EQ controls are very interactive with each other. You can kind of approximate a Fender Bassman with a Plexi by diming the bass and treble and put the mids on 0. On most amps that would sound like hammered dogshit, but on a Plexi it's pretty bad ass.

Greg,
Johan's latest makes your point pretty well...
[BBvideo=560,315]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zoD7xtFEKTY[/BBvideo]

[JD01]

Not listened to that yet. I'm assuming it's Johan sounding like Johan regardless of what he plays. He would make my old Peavey sound like a Plexi

[Greg_L]

Greg,
I'm looking starting points for settings - MV:V as well as the tone group.
I ought to experiment and decide what my ears tell me is good but you know, as well as I do, that my ears aren't critical enough.
I look forward to a Plexi sample for comparison and any reccos that come with it.

Here ya go Ray. These are kind of long, but they show how my Plexis behave with a humbucker/Les Paul.

Les Paul Traditional - Burstbucker 3 bridge
Marshall Plexi 1959
All tone controls - 5
PPIMV - 5
Marshall 1960A 4x12 - Celestion G12H30
Senn e609 on axis, on grill, dustcap/cone seam - Shure SM57 on axis, on grill, halfway across cone
All tracks 50/50 blend
No EQ or FX

This is the "bright channel", Channel 1, high input 1 only. Channel vol on 2, then 5, then cranked.

LP1959G12H30CH1.mp3

This is the "normal channel", Channel 2, high input 2 only. Channel vol on 2, then 5, then cranked.

LP1959G12H30CH2.mp3

See what you think.

[Greg_L]

Greg,
Johan's latest makes your point pretty well...
[BBvideo=560,315]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zoD7xtFEKTY[/BBvideo]

Yup, that's about right.

[rayc]

Here ya go Ray. These are kind of long, but they show how my Plexis behave with a humbucker/Les Paul.
Les Paul Traditional - Burstbucker 3 bridge
Marshall Plexi 1959
All tone controls - 5
PPIMV - 5
Marshall 1960A 4x12 - Celestion G12H30
Senn e609 on axis, on grill, dustcap/cone seam - Shure SM57 on axis, on grill, halfway across cone
All tracks 50/50 blend
No EQ or FX
See what you think.

Yep, mine doesn't approach the I/Bright on yours. I have all the brightness but no power.
You mentioned in an earlier post that the Superbass was neutered - I think you may be right.
Someone must've modded it at some stage or the factory were running short of some components and made do with what was around - the latter, I've read, isn't unlikely and given it was for bass bo one woul've noticed until a guitar came into the picture.
I've one more experiment to do before contacting the tech, (he's back ay work now), which is to use the bottom inputs as I didn't try them and they may reveal some otehr oddity. When I've done that I've contact the tech. I've written the text but wanted to have covered all bases.
The sounds clips are great by the way and that amp combine with the LP is a marriage made in rock heaven - the song selection also points to a time when that combination were IT.
THANKS very much.

[Greg_L]

Yep, mine doesn't approach the I/Bright on yours. I have all the brightness but no power.
You mentioned in an earlier post that the Superbass was neutered - I think you may be right.
Someone must've modded it at some stage or the factory were running short of some components and made do with what was around - the latter, I've read, isn't unlikely and given it was for bass bo one woul've noticed until a guitar came into the picture.
I've one more experiment to do before contacting the tech, (he's back ay work now), which is to use the bottom inputs as I didn't try them and they may reveal some otehr oddity. When I've done that I've contact the tech. I've written the text but wanted to have covered all bases.
The sounds clips are great by the way and that amp combine with the LP is a marriage made in rock heaven - the song selection also points to a time when that combination were IT.
THANKS very much.

No prob. If you need help explaining details to your tech, just let me know. Maybe we can draft something up to make it perfectly clear what needs to be done. Your amp does not sound bad, it's just not getting the chewy grind that a Super Lead should have.

I did always think it was weird how your Super Bass just would not break up at all. You might be right that something was "off" all along and we just haven't figured it out yet.

The lower inputs test might reveal something.

[rayc]

I tried the lower inputs today and there was no difference with input I, (other than a lower level/response).
With MV on 5 and V on 5 or 7 I decided, as we'd discussed them, to try a little fooling with tone controls.
After gentle nudges here & there I dimed the bass - there was an improvement in tone. I then did the same with mid & treble - again better. Presence as well cool then backed off everything but the presence and the sound was still good.. I tried middle PU position and it was better - then neck pickup and again better.
I haven't recorded a sample as my wife was wearing headphones up stairs to bloke out the noise so I'll have to wait until tomorrow I suppose.
To summarise - the combination of presence and mid or neck pick up seems to push the I input much better - sounds much more like II.
Clips tomorrow I hope.