The Tone Thread

[Minerman]

The "Sweet Child O Mine" riff did it for me.

Lol...yeah dude I know, I know...while I do like a lot of his songs, & IMHO he has some great tones on some great albums, I really don't wanna go there...

I can't comment on how close it is to a Marshall JCM800, as I don't own one to be intimately familiar with all its tones...but you gotta consider that all these amps have a lot of knobs, and moving 1-2 of them just a little, usually changes things noticeably.
IOW...can only a Marshall JCM800 do that tone, and is there only one tone that it can do?
I know the answer is no...and I'm not looking to offend any Marshall fans at all...just saying that even 10 vintage Marshal JCM800 amps don't all sound the same.

I get it dude, it's all good...

AFA the sound of the Ceriatone 2202...and the 6V6 tubes...yeah, there's a difference between them and EL34 tubes, though I always considered the 6V6 to be like the kid brother of the EL34 tube. They both have a bit of that "squish" in the low-mids, with the 6V6 showing a bit more growl, while the EL34 a bit more punch. That said...the tones in the videos are pretty good...but again, you can probably find a lot more with twist of the knobs.

This is the question I'm looking for the answer to, how close are 6V6 to EL34's...

I lieu of an EL34 amp...I would rather use a 6V6 amp that's trying to do the crunch thing instead of an EL84 amp, which IMO sucks at it, and I've never been able to get comfortable with EL84 amps doing fat crunch/distortion tones. There's always something fizzy about them....they're better off doing the Vox-ish chimey thing, IMO...and I've had, and sold every EL84 amp sooner than later. I don't have any more, and will probably never buy another one.

The only EL84 amp I've ever had is my current amp, the 15w EVH LBX...It can get fizzy, especially with the amount of gain it's got, but the fizz can be dialed out to an extent, so my experience with EL84's hasn't been bad, to me, it's just different...I will say my little amp can sound quite thick when it's set to do so...My experience with EL34's has been nothing but positive though, which brings the question about 6V6's...

My current roster is EL34 and 6V6 amps...though I have to say, that last year when I got my fist Carol-Ann (the OD2r)...I was amazed at how much I liked the 6L6 sound of the amp. I'm really liking the clarity and the crunch, plus the low end is like super fucking tight.

I am impressed with those Carol Ann amps dude, to me they sound really good...


I'm still not 100% sure about the 2202, but these clips have opened up some doors for me I thought only led to EL34 amps...I gotta sort some other things first, but it's very possible I'll end up buying a 2202...

[Greg_L]

That's what I thought too dude, where it's got the gain/tone switches, it'd probably cover what the Chupa did too, or a close approximation...

In the 2nd vid, you can see him mess with the ppimv, which is the knob on the far left...I have no idea how loud that was in the room, but I think it sounds pretty fuckin' good...The new ISO cab build would take care of the noise issue for me, so I think I'm gonna pull the trigger on one before too much longer...The ISO cab has to come first though, as it'd be sitting around not being used (like my EVH LBX) until I can do something about the noise...

It seems pretty versatile. It seems that they got the preamp section pretty accurate, so the power tubes won't matter that much. Not all 800s were EL34 amps anyway. Most of the JMP and 800 sounds you know and love from the 80s were 6550 versions.

[rayc]

Grim, he was a nice chap. Didn't post tunes or tones but would engage in dialogue and in much depth. He actually sent me some of his stuff - he wrote terrific songs but hadn't really mixed any of them to completion. He & I were/are LPC fanboys.

[miroslav]

I am impressed with those Carol Ann amps dude, to me they sound really good...

I'm still not 100% sure about the 2202, but these clips have opened up some doors for me I thought only led to EL34 amps...I gotta sort some other things first, but it's very possible I'll end up buying a 2202...

I don't think you will be really disappointed with the Ceriatone, it seems that most their stuff is well received, and you should know, you had one.
If anything...it might be a different flavor, but not a bad taste at all. I love the 6V6 sound.

Without coming off snobby, 'cuz I know the Carol-Ann stuff is a bit pricey and not your basic "working man's" amps that most guys would go for...
...I have now totally fucked myself AFA my other amps.

These two CA amps, the OD2r (6L6) and Texas 50 (EL34) have so much beautiful tone, that I don't see a reason to play the other amps.
I've tried, and I'm just not that interested anymore...so I may end up selling off most of them this year.
I'm talking Dr Z, Carr, Savage...etc....out the door.
The only other amp I would hang on to would be my Swart SST30, because it is a 6V6 amp, and it's in a much different tonal zone than the CA amps, and it has it's own "vibe"....so worth keeping....and I bought it from Mathew Sweet, so kinda cool.

There is a tonal richness to the CA amps that I have not heard in anything I have ever played, to date...no shit.
I've gone through a LOT of amps, always looking for the one that will really shine...and now I've got two of them,m and it's not just the wide range of tones, it's how they react to playing.
If I am able to unload my other amps...I would not be surprised if I ended up buying yet another Carol-Ann.
He's just built a Trainwreck-inspired EL34 amp that is causing a buzz already in that TW world...but it's not a Trainwreck "clone", rather it's his take on that type of tone, with his own design twists and tweaks.

Not saying there are not other great amps out there at all kinds of price points...just saying that these are really doing it for me.
I find that I can play them endlessly and not get bored.

[Minerman]

Greg: Yeah dude I realize the power tubes won't make a huge difference as far as EL34/6V6, I'm just a little wary of buying something blind, but I should be used to it by now...Everything I own was bought "blind", but so far, the only bad thing I bought was the Randall ISO cab...Out of all the rest, some were ok, but the Randall truly sicked...

I don't think you will be really disappointed with the Ceriatone, it seems that most their stuff is well received, and you should know, you had one.
If anything...it might be a different flavor, but not a bad taste at all. I love the 6V6 sound.

Yeah, I agree, I should be pretty confident because I had a Ceriatone, but it's another "blind" buy...As mentioned, I should be used to that by now, I'm just a little nervous it won't live up to the hype I hope it has...

Without coming off snobby, 'cuz I know the Carol-Ann stuff is a bit pricey and not your basic "working man's" amps that most guys would go for...
...I have now totally fucked myself AFA my other amps.

Not snobby at all man, that's your personal preference, doesn't matter about the price at all...If that's what makes you warm & fuzzy, that's what you need...

I understand about comparing everything to your CA amps dude, for me, that's the Chupa I had...That's the baseline for my other tones to be judged by...And yes, I did like the Chupa that much, I really, really hated to sell it, but if I hadn't I'd probably been in a lot worse shape financially...I had a chance to buy it back, but couldn't swing it at the time, & didn't want the guy I sold it to putting himself in a bind because of me (who didn't even need the amp, he just did it as a favor to help me out, which says a lot about him...good guy, period), so I had to just let it go...

[miroslav]

Get another Chupa...I mean, if that's the tone you want, you're forever going to be chasing it now that you know what it is if you get something else.

I would feel the same way now that I heard/played these CA amps...'cuz I was never able to find that sound and feel from anything else I had.

[rayc]

I picked up my squire Mustang on Thursday & have only just had a chance to try it out. It had the usual 1st service job - supposedly fret polish, fret board oil, intonation at bridge and a slight mod to the nut too. Oh, they put on new strings so they could charge me $23 for a set of elixirs.
The thing sounds a bit better in the tuning/intonation dept. I tried it at various volumes and on guitar tone/vol settings.
It's a bit muddy almost everywhere so I'll have to try an EQ pedal (I have a cheap one - from about 1995 and a really weird one that i bought in a garage sale in about 1986, an Ibanez Renometer that requires two 9v batteries [BBvideo=560,315]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-iqkDAjDenk[/BBvideo] ). I'll see if that helps a little - though it may end up being the amp/speakers instead/as well.
It takes a bit of effort to get it to feedback too. Is that a humbucker thing? I suppose not having heard the stuff Greg can conjure from his LPs.
I've contacted a tech who's happy to mod my Superbass. I just have to suss out a shipping company as he's not easy to get to by public transport.

[rayc]

Wow, I just found a reference to the machine - made in 75 until 77 and, at that time, was DM195-198, (whatever that was in relative terms).

[antichef]

Hey everybody - Greg let me know about this place, and of course I went straight to the tone thread. And that's because I must soil each new tone thread with another Stooges cover:

http://otherdog.studio/SearchAndDestroy-v0.2.mp3


That EQ pedal is cool Ray - somehow you were getting a nice treble bite that didn't hurt my ears.

[Greg_L]

Hey everybody - Greg let me know about this place, and of course I went straight to the tone thread. And that's because I must soil each new tone thread with another Stooges cover:

http://otherdog.studio/SearchAndDestroy-v0.2.mp3


That EQ pedal is cool Ray - somehow you were getting a nice treble bite that didn't hurt my ears.

Hey glad you made it in!

Real good tones in that cover. Interesting take on the song. Kind of a wild mix!

[antichef]

Thanks man - I forgot the details:

The main rhythm track was a SG standard with a Dirty Fingers bridge pickup. Our singer had a cold and was getting worse and because I needed a rhythm track immediately to get vocals, I just went DI and used an amp sym for him to sing. Later I reamped that track through my JCM 800 with the greenbacks 4x12 - I think the reamp signal was hotter than it maybe should have been, but I got settled on the sound

The leads were with my usual stock SG Supreme. I think I used an Orange OR100. The echo for the leads and vocals is a RE-201 that I found in a pawn shop earlier this year.

[Minerman]

Ray: Pretty cool pedal, reckon it has any collector's value???

Hey everybody - Greg let me know about this place, and of course I went straight to the tone thread. And that's because I must soil each new tone thread with another Stooges cover:

http://otherdog.studio/SearchAndDestroy-v0.2.mp3


That EQ pedal is cool Ray - somehow you were getting a nice treble bite that didn't hurt my ears.

Good to see you dude, I was wondering about you last night man & here you are...

Your clip sounds good man, especially the guitars, they sound great IMO...


Speaking of old friends from HR, has anyone heard from Sky Blue Lou???

[Greg_L]

I picked up my squire Mustang on Thursday & have only just had a chance to try it out. It had the usual 1st service job - supposedly fret polish, fret board oil, intonation at bridge and a slight mod to the nut too. Oh, they put on new strings so they could charge me $23 for a set of elixirs.
The thing sounds a bit better in the tuning/intonation dept. I tried it at various volumes and on guitar tone/vol settings.
It's a bit muddy almost everywhere so I'll have to try an EQ pedal (I have a cheap one - from about 1995 and a really weird one that i bought in a garage sale in about 1986, an Ibanez Renometer that requires two 9v batteries [BBvideo=560,315]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-iqkDAjDenk[/BBvideo] ). I'll see if that helps a little - though it may end up being the amp/speakers instead/as well.
It takes a bit of effort to get it to feedback too. Is that a humbucker thing? I suppose not having heard the stuff Greg can conjure from his LPs.
I've contacted a tech who's happy to mod my Superbass. I just have to suss out a shipping company as he's not easy to get to by public transport.

It might just be your pickups are muddy. Sometimes basic production budget humbuckers are muddy as hell. Not a whole lot you can do about it besides swap them out, swap out some pots, or use an EQ...which you are already thinking about.

As for getting feedback, a humbucker will feedback all day long. Getting a good feedback only requires one thing - volume. Lots of gain will do it too, but big volume feedback is usually better than high gain feedback.

[rayc]

Thanks Greg. Where the Mosrite copy would be jumping in my hands the Mustang is still not squealing and the Bruno would be twisting itself apart (as a semi acoustic would).
I'll get there .

[Greg_L]

Thanks Greg. Where the Mosrite copy would be jumping in my hands the Mustang is still not squealing and the Bruno would be twisting itself apart (as a semi acoustic would).
I'll get there .

That is pretty interesting that your other guitars will feedback more easily.

[antichef]

Does the mustang have low output pickups?

That can be a good thing for tone, to be sure.

But it would also lessen the tendency to feed back a little. Maybe. I don't know what I'm talking about.

[WhiskeyJack]

Shit.

That Ceriatone rig is pretty nice actually. And i checked the price range and it is not unreasonable. Not bad for a little amp.

Hey Antichef welcome aboard and nice share with the stooges tune. that mix is definitely interesting as hell man. It made it really fun to listen to if i am being honest. It is kind of all over the place but it totally kind of just works given the chaotic nature of the song.

[rayc]

That EQ pedal is cool Ray - somehow you were getting a nice treble bite that didn't hurt my ears.

Anti - welcome.
Not my vid/demo sady BUT I do have the pedal and will need it.
I like your Stooges stooge.
I found the vocals closer to PAW in a few spots - maybe the not too close double take - or is it a duet?
[BBvideo=560,315]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aCKlTJxGAuI[/BBvideo]

[antichef]

yeah - it was sloppy double tracking that degraded into a duet - haha. It was the singer's head cold, I think - usually comes out tighter. I hadn't heard of PAW - liked that song

Another issue is that our drummer moved to Beaumont TX before we cut this (seemed like a great move until about Thursday of last week), so this is actually the computer on drums -- came out better than I thought it would. So my band, the Flying Monkease, is at a pretty low ebb at the moment, but we'll be back...

Thanks everyone - glad you enjoyed the song.

I'll get some more guitar tones up soon. Awesome to see this thread going. Great to know about Cieratone.

[liv_rong]

I feel like an ass posting my stuff in here since I dont contribute, but the reason I stay away is because I dont have much to contribute, I dont know shit! Anyways, here is a little snippet from something I was messing around with today, It my hh tele into the Mesa Mark 5:25 head with an Orange 1x12 loaded with a V30. I changed the mic to now be slightly off axis and it seems to be working better. This is two guitar tracks, both on the bridge pickup but one track is normal humbucker and the other track is split coil. Panning, compression and limiter and the master. I think it sounds much better than any distorted sounds Ive captured before, but I did have practice for a few hours earlier so my ears are shot haha.

Thanks for the listen.