The Tone Thread

[Greg_L]

Ok, here are a few clips with the "stereo" amp setup I've been babbling about...All amp settings are the same except for the clean clips, I used the Jubilee's clean channel & the 800's low input...I did have to bump the gain on the 800's low input from 7-ish to 10 in order to half-ass level their volume though...

Signal chain:

Strat > MXR Phase 95 > TC Electronic Univibe >

• ..............................................................Mini Jubilee > V30 > SM57 (panned 70% left)

• ..............................................................Mini 800 > EVH Greenback > i5 (panned 70% right)

MXR Phaser:

• Blue/95 mode
  Speed:.....2

TC Electronic Univibe:

• Speed:.............0
  Intensity:..........5
  Volume:...........10

Amp settings:

Mini Jubilee:
20w mode
Lead channel

• Presence:..................6
  Bass:.......................7
  Middle:.....................4
  Treble:.....................4
  Master Output:............5
  Lead Master:..............10
  Gain:......................7.5

Mini JCM 800:
20w mode

• Presence:..................3
  Bass:.......................5
  Middle:.....................10
  Treble:.....................4
  Master:....................5
  Gain:......................7.5

Dirty:
Stereo Mini Marshall DIRTY 10-15-2019.mp3

Dry clean:
Stereo Mini Marshall CLEAN 10-15-2019.mp3

Phase only clean:
Stereo Mini Marshall PHASE CLEAN 10-15-2019.mp3

Univibe only clean:
Stereo Mini Marshall UNIVIBE CLEAN 10-15-2019.mp3

Phase & Univibe clean:
Stereo Mini Marshall PHASE UNIVIBE CLEAN 10-15-2019.mp3

I'm positive these aren't in phase, no doubt in my mind, but, what the fuck...There's also some bleed in the mics where I had the little amps up pretty loud, so I'll have to work on a solution for that, but I do have a couple ideas...

Lemme know what you guys think of this mess...

It seems like you've done a nice job at getting two amps to play together. They sound good. Not a fan of the univibe, but the phaser sounds good.

To me, most importantly, this test highlights how pretty much useless stereo amps actually are. I've tried it. It's a lot of work for results that just aren't that spectacular. This is one area where just slapping a stereo plug-in across a guitar track is probably better IMO. It's a fun and interesting exercise though, for sure.

[Minerman]

It seems like you've done a nice job at getting two amps to play together. They sound good. Not a fan of the univibe, but the phaser sounds good.

To me, most importantly, this test highlights how pretty much useless stereo amps actually are. I've tried it. It's a lot of work for results that just aren't that spectacular. This is one area where just slapping a stereo plug-in across a guitar track is probably better IMO. It's a fun and interesting exercise though, for sure.

Thanks man...It was a bit more work than setting up a single amp/cab, but it really wasn't that bad...The amps actually surprised me as they sound pretty damn close to one another, in these clips anyway...It sounds good in the room, actually really good, to me anyway...

I'd love to be in the same room with your amps set up like this, but using 2 cabs on each side...

I still haven't connected the univibe pedal to my computer to tweak it's innards, or use any of the toneprint presets...I'm gonna make a point to do that in the next day or so...When turning the pedal on, it made quite a difference in the stereo spread (especially in the room), & part of that was captured in the mics, which surprised me...This pedal has chorus/flange/etc toneprint presets, so I'm probably gonna try to end up tweaking it to use as a stereo widener thing...

Short version: In the next day or so I'm gonna tweak the univibe pedal into a mild chorus or similar, without the wobble/warble...

I have a few stereo plug-ins I've used for this, & you're right, it's a lot easier, plus probably sounds better to just use plug-in for this...

BTW, I'm still very impressed with the little 800...I think it's awesome...

[ocnor]

Beta57-1.mp3

Here is a rough test of my Beta 57 mic.
Signal chain = LPC> Carvin Legacy> Beta 57> Motu interface.
There is no EQ,Compression,or effects. I just slapped the mic up and hit record.

[JD01]

Beta57-1.mp3Here is a rough test of my Beta 57 mic.
Signal chain = LPC> Carvin Legacy> Beta 57> Motu interface.
There is no EQ,Compression,or effects. I just slapped the mic up and hit record.

I think that sounds pretty good actually. Probably mainly your amp, I'd really like to hear a direct comparison to an SM57 to get an idea what that mic is actually like.

However, while I have a 57, I don't use it as a main mic 'cos I find there's a harsh upper mid/high to them that grates on my ears (that's why I use an i5, as I find it smoother), but even though you've got a pretty bright tone there I don't hear a harshness to it.

[JD01]

Also, Ocnor - I've just seen your EQ curve response in the NMD thread since listening - this might be the reason I don't feel that harshness I don't like in a 57... or it may just be the tone you have!

[ocnor]

Beta57-1.mp3Here is a rough test of my Beta 57 mic.
Signal chain = LPC> Carvin Legacy> Beta 57> Motu interface.
There is no EQ,Compression,or effects. I just slapped the mic up and hit record.

I think that sounds pretty good actually. Probably mainly your amp, I'd really like to hear a direct comparison to an SM57 to get an idea what that mic is actually like.

However, while I have a 57, I don't use it as a main mic 'cos I find there's a harsh upper mid/high to them that grates on my ears (that's why I use an i5, as I find it smoother), but even though you've got a pretty bright tone there I don't hear a harshness to it.

Yes it gets a nice bright tone without the harshness of the SM57. My amp is quite thick sounding so it worked out pretty well. I only had the amp on 1 so it will sound even better when I can crank it up.The i5 is just a little too scooped sounding for me. The other mic I was checking out was the MD421, but I couldn't justify spending the extra cash.

[WhiskeyJack]

@Greg_L or anybody else....

So, I've got my "stereo" amp setup running, & I gotta say, it sounds fuckin' glorious in the room...I've got the mic levels about as even as I can, but there's still a problem: mic phase...

I'm gonna assume this is gonna be totally impossible to get 2 mics on 2 different cabs in phase, but I'm asking anyway...Any help???

Signal chain: Strat > Univibe (stereo outs, L & R) > Mini 800/EVH 4x12 > i5, Mini Jubilee/1960A 4x12 > '57

Clips are on the way regardless...

I might be way wrong here but hear me out. In theory only, if all four mics are going to individual mono tracks your phase issues should be able to be fixed using the phase inverter flip icon in reaper and if thats still not good enough you can probably slide each track and nudge a bit until things get clearer?

I may be very wrong in this assumption based on how i understand things to work after my last kick a three mics on one cab, but the phase inverter button basically was my security blanket / saving grace. I gave 0 fucks if my mic placements gave me phase issues on the way in, and those tracks turned out great by my own standards. I was VERY pleased with them for once.

[Minerman]

I might be way wrong here but hear me out. In theory only, if all four mics are going to individual mono tracks your phase issues should be able to be fixed using the phase inverter flip icon in reaper and if thats still not good enough you can probably slide each track and nudge a bit until things get clearer?

I may be very wrong in this assumption based on how i understand things to work after my last kick a three mics on one cab, but the phase inverter button basically was my security blanket / saving grace. I gave 0 fucks if my mic placements gave me phase issues on the way in, and those tracks turned out great by my own standards. I was VERY pleased with them for once.

I only used 2 mics Shan...The "stereo" thing was just me babbling about using 2 amps/cabs at once dude...Sorry I wasn't more clear on that...

The phase actually didn't even cross my mind at the time, I was just trying to get the best mic placement for each mic...So in a nutshell, I half-assed dialed the amps in, then messed with the mics until I thought they sounded ok, then hit record...


You are correct about the phase though, I should've kept moving them until they were close enough, then if needed, I could slide 'em around in the daw a bit...

[TripleM]

Ok, here are a few clips with the "stereo" amp setup I've been babbling about...All amp settings are the same except for the clean clips, I used the Jubilee's clean channel & the 800's low input...I did have to bump the gain on the 800's low input from 7-ish to 10 in order to half-ass level their volume though...

Signal chain:

Strat > MXR Phase 95 > TC Electronic Univibe >

• ..............................................................Mini Jubilee > V30 > SM57 (panned 70% left)

• ..............................................................Mini 800 > EVH Greenback > i5 (panned 70% right)

MXR Phaser:

• Blue/95 mode
  Speed:.....2

TC Electronic Univibe:

• Speed:.............0
  Intensity:..........5
  Volume:...........10

Amp settings:

Mini Jubilee:
20w mode
Lead channel

• Presence:..................6
  Bass:.......................7
  Middle:.....................4
  Treble:.....................4
  Master Output:............5
  Lead Master:..............10
  Gain:......................7.5

Mini JCM 800:
20w mode

• Presence:..................3
  Bass:.......................5
  Middle:.....................10
  Treble:.....................4
  Master:....................5
  Gain:......................7.5

Dirty:
Stereo Mini Marshall DIRTY 10-15-2019.mp3

Dry clean:
Stereo Mini Marshall CLEAN 10-15-2019.mp3

Phase only clean:
Stereo Mini Marshall PHASE CLEAN 10-15-2019.mp3

Univibe only clean:
Stereo Mini Marshall UNIVIBE CLEAN 10-15-2019.mp3

Phase & Univibe clean:
Stereo Mini Marshall PHASE UNIVIBE CLEAN 10-15-2019.mp3

I'm positive these aren't in phase, no doubt in my mind, but, what the fuck...There's also some bleed in the mics where I had the little amps up pretty loud, so I'll have to work on a solution for that, but I do have a couple ideas...

Lemme know what you guys think of this mess...

I thought the first dirty clip sounded great. That's a sound that's going to work well in a lot of mixes.

I liked the first clean-only tone too. Articulate without being brittle.

When you added the phase in, I thought it would probably work well in certain situations. But probably not for a guitar part that is playing all the way through a tune. You'd have to pick your spots.

The clips with the Univibe weren't something I liked. All the bouncing back and forth got distracting quickly.

[Minerman]

I thought the first dirty clip sounded great. That's a sound that's going to work well in a lot of mixes.

I liked the first clean-only tone too. Articulate without being brittle.

When you added the phase in, I thought it would probably work well in certain situations. But probably not for a guitar part that is playing all the way through a tune. You'd have to pick your spots.

The clips with the Univibe weren't something I liked. All the bouncing back and forth got distracting quickly.

Thanks man, for what little time I actually spent doing this, it tuned out ok I suppose...There is potential using 2 amps, but isn't something I'll probably do very often...

I will say it sounded awesome in the room...lol...

Both the phase & univibe are cool (to me), but they do need to be used sparingly for sure...

Thanks again...

[Minerman]

Not sure I'd wanna try this , but there is a difference in the clips he has here...Could be different mic placement for before/after or could be a million other things...

[BBvideo=560,315]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CQ6v6gOnyh0[/BBvideo]

[ocnor]

Normally I really like that guy's videos but sanding down a speaker is completely retarded. The sanded speaker sounded like total ass and nothing like the vintage one.

[Minerman]

Normally I really like that guy's videos but sanding down a speaker is completely retarded. The sanded speaker sounded like total ass and nothing like the vintage one.

He has another video doing the same thing...I think he posted it a week or so ago...

The way I see it, it's his speaker, if he wants to basically ruin it, more power to him...Even the Chinese versions to me ain't cheap at $125 a pop, & I sure ain't gonna take sandpaper to any of my speakers...

Although, that might be an improvement for the clips I post...

[Minerman]

Ok, here's a few clips just thrown together, just like all the others I post here...

Just messing around comparing the different od pedals I have, Mini Tube Screamer, Boss Super OD, Boss Distiortion...I still need to try the Real Tube through the Mini 800, so there's your warning...

I did use the attenuator on these clips & these were recorded about the usual volume I'd normally use...Not ear bleeding loud, but much louder than what I'd consider "bedroom" volume...


Signal Chain: strat > TS9 - SD-1 - DS1 > Mini 800 > PS1 attenuator > G12-65 > SM57 (no post fx added in the daw)

• Mini TS9:
  Tone:.............5
  Level:............10
  Gain:..............0
  
  Boss SD-1:
  Level:............10
  Tone:............2.5
  Drive:............3
  
  Boss DS-1:
  Level:.............3
  Dist:...............3
  Tone:............3.5
  
  Presence:........4
  Bass:.............6
  Middle:..........3.5
  Treble:..........6
  Volume:.........5
  Gain:............7
  
  PS1 attenuator:............5

Guitar straight into the amp:

Mini 800 10-18-2019.mp3

Boosted with Ibanez Mini TS9:

Mini 800 TS9 10-18-2019.mp3

Boosted with Boss SD-1:

Mini 800 SD-1 10-18-2019.mp3

Boosted with Boss DS-1:

Mini 800 DS-1 10-18-2019.mp3

My nephew (the preacher) told me the Boss DS-1 was a "Keeley Modded" pedal, but I don't see any stickers or id anywhere confirming that...It may have been modded "like a Keeley" or something...I'm actually not liking this thing very much, through a dirty amp anyway...I think it's awful as a clean boost like the SD-1 or TS9, even with really low tone/gain/level settings...Ran through a pretty clean amp, it's not terrible, but it's still not in the same league as my other boost pedals...I'm on the fence about it & may just pick up a stock pedal to compare this one with...If I don't change my mind, most likely I'll give it back to my nephew...

And, I think the Mini 800 sound it's best on it's own, no boost & no attenuator...I'm gonna have to do a shootout with the Chupacabra & the Mini 800 to see if it can keep up with my "benchmark" amp...

[ocnor]

Although, that might be an improvement for the clips I post...

Dude your clips sound fine to me. I'd like to hear a direct comparison of the Chupa to the mini Marshalls.

[Minerman]

Although, that might be an improvement for the clips I post...

Dude your clips sound fine to me. I'd like to hear a direct comparison of the Chupa to the mini Marshalls.

Thanks man...I'm gonna have to get that rolling...I gotta say, I'm really, really happy with my little amp stable right now...Of course, the Chupacabra is my #1 & will always be, but the Mini 800 has knocked the Mini Jubilee out of the #2 slot by a mile...

I'm really impressed with the new amp, & I'm a happy hillbilly...

I meant to comment on your clip the other day...Sounds pretty thick, a bit smoother & darker than the usual SM57, which I'm assuming is what you were after...

[Minerman]

I finally got around to using the pc editor for the univibe pedal & it's ok...The univibe sounds are pretty good IMO, & I can slow the speed/rate down to a much better sounding position, but the chorus/flanger the pedal does are just ok...It sounds "like" a chorus or flanger, but it's just not quite there...

More tweaking in the editor may be needed, but more than likely an actual flanger is the only thing that will scratch that itch...

I'm more than happy with the univibe though, so the pedalboard "list" is getting smaller...

[Minerman]

More Mini 800 clips, this time messing around with the toneprint feature on the new univibe...This patch has a flanger combined with the univibe...More tweaking is probably needed, but I think it may work for some of my weird fx sounds...

Signal Chain: strat bridge HB > univibe > TS9/SD1 > Mini 800 (5w mode) > PS1 attenuator > 65 > SM57

• TC Electronic Univibe:
  "Flanged Vibes" toneprint
  Speed:.............0
  Intensity:..........7
  Volume:...........10
  
  Mini TS9:
  Tone:.............7
  Level:............10
  Gain:..............0
  
  Boss SD-1:
  Level:............10
  Tone:............2.5
  Drive:............3
  
  Mini JCM 800:
  5w mode
  Presence:...........4
  Bass:................6
  Middle:.............3.5
  Treble:..............6
  Volume:.............5
  Gain:...............10
  
  PS1 attenuator:................10 (full volume)

Uni-flange only:

Mini 800 5w UNIFLANGE 10-19-2019.mp3

Uni-flange & Mini TS9:

Mini 800 5w UNIFLANGE_TS9 10-19-2019.mp3

Uni-flange & SD-1:

Mini 800 5w UNIFLANGE_SD1 10-19-2019.mp3

And, here's an un-attenuated, no bost/fx clip of the Mini 800 in 20w mode, with the same amp settings:

Mini 800 _DRY_ 10-19-2019.mp3

Lemme know what you guys think....

BTW, I'm still gonna do the Chupacabra vs. the Mini 800 in the next day or two...

[ocnor]

Nice! I can tell that it's a TC Electronic effect because my G-Major 2 can pretty much get that same sound. The 20w mode clip sounded the best to me. I'd like to hear an un-attenuated ,no boost , 20w mode clip with the effect in the FX loop.

[Minerman]

Nice! I can tell that it's a TC Electronic effect because my G-Major 2 can pretty much get that same sound. The 20w mode clip sounded the best to me. I'd like to hear an un-attenuated ,no boost , 20w mode clip with the effect in the FX loop.

Thanks dude, I'm pretty impressed with the TC Electronic pedal, so much so that I'll probably buy a TC Electronic UniTune in the next few days since the Snark I've been using finally died after 5+ years...

I'll make a clip with your suggestions tomorrow dude...

I know I'm still in the honeymoon phase with the new amp, but I'm lovin' this little amp...It feels a lot like when I first got the Chupacabra 5 years ago, I was caught off guard by that amp, & the Mini 800 feels a lot like that...