The Tone Thread

[Greg_L]

The Mutant
EXCELLENT.
You've the best of all worlds without having a whiff of modern metal about it.
Well done.

Thanks Ray. Still figuring it out but it's getting there.

JCMutant?
Sounds great, Greg! You must be well happy with that.
The 1st run through might be a little mild for me.
The 2nd and 3rd are both brilliant!
The 4th and 5th sound great too, pretty high gain, but they're still really useable good tones, they've got a bit of an early Metallica thing!
The 6th sounds good and I bet its fun to play but it seems like its starting to flub out a bit.
That last one might sound really good with a boost in front to tighten up the bottom - it would be proper metal then though!

Thanks dude. One thing I've noticed about it that's exactly like the real 800 is that the bass needs to be rolled back a bit as the gain goes maxxed out. I suppose a drawback about this setup is it's a shared EQ. Not that I'll ever be walking up to it and pulling the switch mid song or anything. But on the flip side, I never go full-gain anyway. I don't ever go past like 7-8 on the real 800. At that point I'd rather stay there and use a clean boost to keep it tighter. I do occasionally go full-on 10 with the Plexis though, but they're one less gain stage. I'm encouraged that the sound doesn't fall apart though. It does get a little flubby at max, but I've never heard an amp that doesn't. I think I can roll that flub out or tighten it with a boost. That sounds like a good test for today.

[JD01]

Cool, try a few different boosts with that crazy hi-gain tone at the end.

[Greg_L]

Cool, try a few different boosts with that crazy hi-gain tone at the end.

It's already a billion times better than it was when the cascade was the other way around. This version has a much smoother character to it, even at ridiculous levels. And it's more gain than I'd ever use. I'll try some boost pedals today.

[Greg_L]

Keep us updated dude...

Well, if it seemed to good to be true, that's because it is. It's a Marshall SLP reissue with a Metro board and PPIMV and Mercury OT for sure....that doesn't work worth a fuck. First off, it's not even a Super Lead anymore. The previous owner built it into a Super Bass. Secondly, it's a pretty shoddy wiring/soldering clusterfuck. Thirdly, it squeals and is totally unusable at anything above talking volume. It's got pretty much the most god-awful oscillation there ever was. The low inputs don't work. It's just a mess that needs one thing fixed just to see if the next thing is good or bad. It basically needs to be gone through from the guitar inputs to the speaker jacks and we aint doing all that. It's being returned. I knew $800 was too good to be true.

[Minerman]

Well, if it seemed to good to be true, that's because it is. It's a Marshall SLP reissue with a Metro board and PPIMV and Mercury OT for sure....that doesn't work worth a fuck. First off, it's not even a Super Lead anymore. The previous owner built it into a Super Bass. Secondly, it's a pretty shoddy wiring/soldering clusterfuck. Thirdly, it squeals and is totally unusable at anything above talking volume. It's got pretty much the most god-awful oscillation there ever was. The low inputs don't work. It's just a mess that needs one thing fixed just to see if the next thing is good or bad. It basically needs to be gone through from the guitar inputs to the speaker jacks and we aint doing all that. It's being returned. I knew $800 was too good to be true.

Well dude, that sucks but at least it can be returned to get the $$$ back...

This is a big reason I've always leery of buying a used amp, because you never know if somebody has butchered it, & I actually wouldn't know what to look for anyway...

[Greg_L]

Well dude, that sucks but at least it can be returned to get the $$$ back...

This is a big reason I've always leery of buying a used amp, because you never know if somebody has butchered it, & I actually wouldn't know what to look for anyway...

Well he/we knew it was modded. But for 800 bucks he felt it was worth the risk. We immediately called the guy back and told him it was fucked up. He obviously never had it past TV volume, which is lame, so it's possible he never knew that it would freak out if you turned it up. How he ended up wiring it as a Super Bass is anyone's guess. Maybe that was intentional, or maybe he just followed any layout he could find, but it aint no Super Lead. As soon as we turned it on, the channel volumes low, I was like that aint right. It was thick and muddy and dark and that aint the bright channel of a Super Lead. So he agreed to give my buddy his money back. No harm no foul. At least I got to play amp detective a little bit.

[rayc]

SOLID STATE TONE...
Not really. I've had this Australian built 250 watt power mixers for almost 30 years.
I think I paid about 300 for it back then. I used it as a PA for quite a few things and ran school discos with it as well.
I'd put it away and forgotten about it until recently - THEN I tried to sell it for $200 and had no takers.
I opened it up to take snaps for advertising and discovered it has a reverb tank inside, (I'd though the reverb was less old school).
I recalled using the thing to record a guitar track with reverb back in the 80s.
I've decided that since no one wanted to buy it I'll set it up and use the instrument in & line out for some spring reverb fun.
Well, I hope to do.

mixer.jpg

[Greg_L]

Haha awesome Ray. That'll be the biggest, most powerful Reverb pedal ever. You can probably drive the input to your amp pretty damn hard too.

[JD01]

That's cool!

I've actually started to think that I might like the cheap mixer technique going before my AI. Not for any tonal reason, just 'cos I could do with a 3rd input.

[Minerman]

Ray: Very cool man, that looks like the pa we used in my first band...The guy who owned it & most of the gear in general passed away a few years ago...I'd thought about contacting his wife/widow to see if she'd wanna sell any of it, but I didn't wanna make any waves in any way at all...

In other news, I rolled the 'ol Bastard cab out of the closet, put the speakers back in it, & I'm gonna start using it again...I still plan on using the ISO cab, but will keep the T-75 & a condenser mic in it, basically for scratch tracks/late night playing/practicing...I've yet to try the Mini Jubilee through that cab, it sounds pretty good with those speakers in the ISO cab, so it should sound good, maybe even better with a proper cab...

[Greg_L]

Here's some brootalz with the JCM1987 + Tube Screamer. I don't know what I'm doing here.

Gibson Angus SG - Angus sig bridge pickup
Tube Screamer - Drive 9:00 - Volume 3:00 - Tone 10:00
Marshall JCM1987 bastardization - JCM 800 mode
Presence - 5
Bass - 6
Mid - 3.5
Treb - 6
Gain - max
Master vol - 4
PPIMV - max
Marshall 1960A 4x12 - Celestion Greenbacks
MXL R144 on axis, on grill, center - Audix i5 on axis, on grill halfway across cone
Um, about a 60/40 blend i5/r144
No FX or EQ

brootalz.mp3

[rayc]

The 1st chord sounded like Black Sabbath.
Sounds a little phased or flanged or something when you're doing the chugga bits.
That is brutal stuff - early 70s metals etc.
The Brute, the Brutalizer
I quite liked it.

[Greg_L]

The 1st chord sounded like Black Sabbath.
Sounds a little phased or flanged or something when you're doing the chugga bits.
That is brutal stuff - early 70s metals etc.
The Brute, the Brutalizer
I quite liked it.

Lol. I really don't know what to do with shit like that. There is a flanger on part of it.

[Minerman]

Here's some brootalz with the JCM1987 + Tube Screamer. I don't know what I'm doing here.

Gibson Angus SG - Angus sig bridge pickup
Tube Screamer - Drive 9:00 - Volume 3:00 - Tone 10:00
Marshall JCM1987 bastardization - JCM 800 mode
Presence - 5
Bass - 6
Mid - 3.5
Treb - 6
Gain - max
Master vol - 4
PPIMV - max
Marshall 1960A 4x12 - Celestion Greenbacks
MXL R144 on axis, on grill, center - Audix i5 on axis, on grill halfway across cone
Um, about a 60/40 blend i5/r144
No FX or EQ

I absolutely love the upper mid/high end of this clip, it "bites"...It's got snarl & sounds just plain pissed off, I love it man...

For the first part Greg was on Ratt Patrol, then he became Unchained, & from there I guess he had a sip of Jdude's Kool-Aid & ended up somewhere in Hetfield-land or Metallica-ville...



I know you guys are probably tired of hearing me go on about the Marshall Origin, but I've got high hopes for that amp...Of course it ain't gonna have that amount of gain even with the boost engaged, but I really hope pushing the front end with a pedal will get it there...

I've been eyeballin' those Chandler Tube Driver pedals that originally came out in the 80's, I remember wanting one when I had my BC Rich Warlock & original Marshall Micro Stack...Even now, they're pretty pricey, & there are a lot of variations of 'em, but I've heard good things about 'em...BK Butler still builds these pedals, one at a time when ordered, for $300...Most likely I'd buy used, but you never know...


The Ibanez Tube King is supposed to be pretty close to those (I've read BK Butler designed the older, tan models), & they're not quite as expensive, so I'm looking around for an actual tube boost/od pedal...Of course, I'll have to keep looking/searching for more info...Used they go for about $125-150...


Just out of curiosity I watched a few videos of the Orange OR15 today & I was impressed...That was the amp I had picked to buy, but with a last-minute change, I ended up with the Chupacabra...While I like EL34's a lot more than EL84's, I thought the clips of the OR15 sounded great...

[Greg_L]

Haha thanks miner. I don't know how to play those 80s songs so I just winged it. The rest was dumb one finger drop D shit. I'm mainly still making sure everything works as it should on this amp. That was pretty loud and really gained up and pushed and it all held together so that's a win for me.

[Minerman]

Haha thanks miner. I don't know how to play those 80s songs so I just winged it. The rest was dumb one finger drop D shit. I'm mainly still making sure everything works as it should on this amp. That was pretty loud and really gained up and pushed and it all held together so that's a win for me.

I know that kinda music ain't your thing dude...I gotta say I really like that sound though man...

Have you messed with the Orange OR15 any dude???

[Greg_L]

Have you messed with the Orange OR15 any dude???

Not much. My Orange experience is somewhat limited to mostly the TH30 or Rockerverbs.

[Minerman]

Have you messed with the Orange OR15 any dude???

Not much. My Orange experience is somewhat limited to mostly the TH30 or Rockerverbs.

Ok dude, no biggie, I just watched a few YT vids of that amp today & it impressed me...Even though it's an EL84 amp, it just sounded great to me...

I think Lt. Bob has or had one, I remember talking with him at HR about it, but then I changed my mind at the last minute & bought the Chupa...I'd also been talking to the guy from G&R Amps about a hand-built 10w baby plexi, but backed out on that too...


Small rant here:
This has been on my mind for a few days now...Do these kids today realize how good they have it with all the technology & information at their fingertips??? I would've killed to have the shit they have now when I was a teenager...I bet my parents would've killed for me to be able to use ampsims/modelers silently at home...I know I drove my parents absolutely bat-shit crazy with my music, but they hardly said a word...

Do you remember "Guitar For The Practicing Musician"??? That was a huge deal for me, I was a subscriber for years, we'd get 4 songs a month tabbed out, & at least half the time they were songs I wasn't even remotely interested in, but I'd learn 'em anyway...Now these kids have any song they'd want tabbed out, with videos showing how it's done...It just boggles my mind how much shit is out there this day & time, but most of the kids now aren't worth a fuck at playing an instrument...

And, the recording gear we have today...I remember my bass player had a Tascam 4-track, that recorded on cassette tapes, & something like that was pretty much "un-obtainable" for most of us back then...Now, again, they've got anything they could imagine to use...

I must be gettin' old...

[rayc]

I tried guitar into PA through Reverb tank and from the Line Out into my Marshall.
I disn't think to pull out a single coil guitar - oh well.
The spring must be fairly short - well it is a PA and it would have been for vocals - as the reverb doesn't have a long tail.
Here's a quick demo. 1st phrase reverb is at nought, then at noon then three o'clock then max.
After that a few noodles to try to work out what it has to offer.

reverbtank.mp3

[Greg_L]

I tried guitar into PA through Reverb tank and from the Line Out into my Marshall.
I disn't think to pull out a single coil guitar - oh well.
The spring must be fairly short - well it is a PA and it would have been for vocals - as the reverb doesn't have a long tail.
Here's a quick demo. 1st phrase reverb is at nought, then at noon then three o'clock then max.
After that a few noodles to try to work out what it has to offer.
reverbtank.mp3

That's not that bad to me. I like it. Not an all the time kind of thing, but it's pretty cool.