The Tone Thread

[ido1957]

Oh maybe this thread already is a sticky.

[Greg_L]

Excellent tone on the "new" guitar Greg. The splits sound good too - an option you have but may not use but still an option.
Well done.

Thanks Ray!

Have to echo everyone else's comment about the noise being gone - this made a huge difference in my mind.
But if you had crap pickups, it would just be "nice". These pickups sound excellent and with the wiring and pot changes, it's a big step up.
The clarity remains when you roll back on the other clips, so you don't lose that tone.
Now you have to decide which one you like better - the Goldtop or the Custom. Decisions, decisions, decisions...

Great thread - lots of people are going to find this helpful when wondering how to do it and the results it yields.
We should sticky this.

Thanks man. I'm gonna have to spend more time with the Custom to see if it's better than the Goldtop. It did definitely close the gap though.

[WhiskeyJack]

Oh maybe this thread already is a sticky.

[rammer24]

Here's somethnig I'm working on.

I usually wait until I put drums down, but I changed some things in my guitar set up, so I want to get some opinions. This is just place holder drum machine, which sucks but shouldn't matter right now.

There's a solo that starts at about 2:08, which is what I'm most concerned with. I find that my lead tone is sometimes too piercing or thin. So, I tried a different sound. Let me know how it works.

NIGHT OF THE GIVING HEAD

[ido1957]

Wow - smooth creamy rhythms there Rami - really really nice. And the syncopation/stop starts make for an excellent arrangement.
The new tone on the lead is good - not piercing, sings good. Write down those settings.
(I wanted to add my comment back here lol - go cut and paste your amp stuff response - it's good info. )

[rammer24]

Lol!

"Awesome. Thanx Ido. My Fender Super Champ X2 is a modelling amp. A few months ago, I found the one or two sounds that I liked. But when I got my Gibson SG, the patch that sounded good on my Epi's P-90's seemed to get a little thin and annoying with the Gibson. So instead of using the "British Lead", which is supposed to emulate a "Marshall", I tried a "Modern American" which is supposed to be a "Mesa Triple Rectifier" emulation. I remember not liking that "Mesa" patch, but it seems to smooth out my bridge pick-up on the Gibson, so I guess I'll be using it more often."

[ido1957]

My Custom has that piercing on the bridge - I'm doing a tone knob and volume drop which helps a bit.
Do you notice that low notes are one volume and upper notes (like high on the B and E strings) are louder? Maybe my ears are getting old but I swear the fequencies are hyped on the pickup or something. The Strat doesn't have that issue and never has. The knob adjustments help but I still hear a difference.

[rammer24]

Do you notice that low notes are one volume and upper notes (like high on the B and E strings) are louder?

I'll check that out tonight. I'll listen for it. I haven't noticed.

When I did a shootout of my pick-ups, I found that my Epi's P-90 neck pick-up is muddy compared to the Gibson's neck humbucker. I like the Gibson's neck pick-up better. Always, no matter what amp setting.

But The Epi's P-90 bridge pick-up is sometimes nicer than the Gibson's bridge humbucker, at times, depending on the amp setting.

So, what I started doing for my rythm tracks, is put the Epi bridge on one side, and the Gibson's neck on the other. Then, I decide what guitar to use for the "3rd" track and solo.

[Greg_L]

My Custom has that piercing on the bridge - I'm doing a tone knob and volume drop which helps a bit.
Do you notice that low notes are one volume and upper notes (like high on the B and E strings) are louder? Maybe my ears are getting old but I swear the fequencies are hyped on the pickup or something. The Strat doesn't have that issue and never has. The knob adjustments help but I still hear a difference.

You might need to tweak the pickup height on the treble side. If you've got high notes overpowering low notes, just drop the treble side of the pickup a little and see if that helps.

[Greg_L]

Here's somethnig I'm working on.

I usually wait until I put drums down, but I changed some things in my guitar set up, so I want to get some opinions. This is just place holder drum machine, which sucks but shouldn't matter right now.

There's a solo that starts at about 2:08, which is what I'm most concerned with. I find that my lead tone is sometimes too piercing or thin. So, I tried a different sound. Let me know how it works.

NIGHT OF THE GIVING HEAD

Goddamn that's some tight rhythm playing.

I think the lead tone is pretty good. It's a little raunchier than your usual lead tones. I think all of the tones are a little fizzy, or they're really bordering on it. I think it sounds cool, but man they're right there at the brink of too much fizz IMO.

And AWESOME title. If that is just a working title, make it the real title.

[ido1957]

I can't believe it's butter - er I mean a modelling amp Sounds good man.

[rammer24]

Goddamn that's some tight rhythm playing.

I think the lead tone is pretty good. It's a little raunchier than your usual lead tones. I think all of the tones are a little fizzy, or they're really bordering on it. I think it sounds cool, but man they're right there at the brink of too much fizz IMO.

And AWESOME title. If that is just a working title, make it the real title.

Thanx Greg. Hehe...That's just a working title. If anyone wants it, I'm sure I'm not the only to have thought of it.

Ok, so a little fuzzy, or on the verge. I'll try moving the mic and screwing with the treble and presence on the amp.

(Listening now, I can hear I can cut the gain on that lead, too.)

[Greg_L]

(Listening now, I can hear I can cut the gain on that lead, too.)

I'd say cut some gain on the rhythms. The lead being raunchy and a little fizzy is fine. I think it's worse with the rhythms.

[rammer24]

OK, updated the file. Tamed the guitars a bit.

NIGHT OF THE GIVING HEAD

[JD01]

Rami, that's really cool guitar solo.
How would you described the tone of the main rhythm guitars - its not something I'd ever go for and sounds really tight. Its thick but not flubby.

[JD01]

I'd like to hear a clip of your amp without any extra EQ and the controls set like this:

Bass= 1 O'clock
mid= 12 O'clock
Treble= 1 O'clock
ISF= 12 O'clock

If you could record 1 clip of the amp mic'd and 1 of the emulated out that would be great. I think that it would help to pin down the cause of your tone issues.

OK, I've got around to this. Clip 1 is my reference clip. Using my previous amp settings, an EQ pedal and a condenser dialed into give it a bit of thickness.


Clip 2: Ocnors suggested amp settings, no EQ pedal - mics as above


Clip 3: Ocnors suggested amp settings, EQ pedal - mics as above.


Clip 4: Ocnors settings, Emulated out, no EQ Pedal


Clip 5: Ocnors settings, Emulated out, EQ Pedal


Any tips you think you can give me would be appreciated.

EDIT: Here's another one - its the same as clip 3 but with the condenser dialed out completely and I think it improves it.

[ido1957]

Rammer - the latest sounds great as well. Early morning rested ears are the most sensitive for me and this is super enjoyable to listen to as I drink my McCafe. It does sound a little chunkier? than the last one but still like I said smooth and thick. That clean lead section is really nice as well.

I finally remembered what the solo tone sounds like - Green Eyed Lady - which was a favorite when I was young. Not the same pattern of course but that classic twang.

That solo bass is tighter than a nun's **** how are you recording that and keeping it so even?

[ido1957]

Hey JD01

Ref clip - bright, open, chunky.
Ocnor's (no eq) - hmm less brights which I prefer, but maybe too much bass if I were to mix this.
Ocnors's (with eq) - better because the bottom end is tighter and the whole spectrum is even.
Ocnor's (emulated) - sounds like reference track so brighter. Prefer the previous one more.
Ocnor's (emulated with EQ) - nope - too bright and raspy.

I prefer Ocnors's (with eq) the best.
All depends on the mix off course but straight guitar that's what I would pick.

Oops - let me submit this part first - and then I'll compare the last one to 3.

[ido1957]

With SM57 - more open, brighter but a good bright like the strings are more punchy. #3 is sort of smoother but not as open. The last one is like sitting in front of the amp, 3 seems cloudier and further back (room effect?)
So I now vote for the last one with just the SM57

[rammer24]

I finally remembered what the solo tone sounds like - Green Eyed Lady - which was a favorite when I was young. Not the same pattern of course but that classic twang.

HA! You're right. Funny how things creep into our sub-conscious. Not only does the lead sound a bit like "Green Eyed....", but even the rythm section under it has a similar feel. Never even crossed my mind, but the influence is definitely there now that you mention it.

That solo bass is tighter than a nun's **** how are you recording that and keeping it so even?

Thanx. I use an Ibanez bass with active pick-ups, plugged straight into my interface. Besides that, 4:1 compression to get about 4-6db of reduction...and Bob's your uncle.