Collab with Alison

[rayc]

A BIAB bloke created a nice 12bar bluesish song with a nice lead throughout that had some good melodic elements.
He's the same fellow I did the country ballad with.
The backing is his choice - midi bass, RD drums, midi electric piano etc. I removed a couple of elements like acoustic guitar.
I wrote some lyrics, a bit dark, and had to think about a singer.
Alison came to mind because she's a really good singer and would probably be fine with the type of lyric. I asked her, & not only did she say yes but she also presented a completed vocal with harmony a day later.
Just a couple of days before falling on the stairs!
Alison's observation about the mix have been excellent and have been applied but I thought I'd ask for more ears.
Here's the song.
All Night Tears by A. David, A. Reynolds & r.cochrane

All Night Tears Alison4b.mp3

Here's a mix with no delay and no reverb on the main vocal:

and another with a tiny bit of reverb but still o delay on the main:

I've dialled back the guitar parts between vocal phrases.
This one has no reverb anywhere:

This one guitar, cymbals/snare/guitar/piano/vocals have the same reverb and same amount:

Here's an update with the transition from intro to V1 smoothed a little:

I've tweaked the ending so it sounds a little less clunky. There were no specific comments re the reverb on the previous mix so I left that as it was:

Tweaked as per MMM's comments. I've taken an hour break from moving my "studio" so decided to do this now:

Quite a few changes on this one...let me know if they work please.

Bass Replaced

AllNightTearsFBc.mp3

The title is Alan's original which works but in the lyric it's a bit clumsy to my ears. I've incorporated it as best I could.
FINISHED AND MASTERED
Alsion did a superb job on this...

LYRICS
You look as though
You've faced a 1000 fears,
Your eyes are red,
Your nose is too.
Tell me what
They did to you.
For you to flood
With all night tears.

It's black and white,
What's gone on tonight
It's black n blue
What's been done to you
It's back to back
& blow by blow
Home is the last place
You should go.

It's plain to
hat happened to you
The narcissist
Beat a fresh tattoo
Don't light a match
The gas is strong
It doesn't matter baby
It's not you who's wrong
Just weeks ago
Was wedding party cheers
A honeymoon
A brand new life
Bad jokes
About trouble & strife
Now love's drowning
In all night tears.

It's black and white
What's gone on tonight
It's black n blue
What's been done to you
It's back to back
& blow by blow
It's not a life
That you should know.
Thoughts?

[Lt. Bob]

wow ...... I'm liking this a lot ..... but for my tastes there's too much delay/verb on the vocals.
They're pretty buried under it.

Otherwise it sounds very good to me and I like the song ..... nice work

[musicturtle]

Sounds good @rayc and @Alison!

I agree with Bob that the verb on the lead vox is a bit heavy...but otherwise I like it.

[rayc]

Thanks @Lt. Bob & @musicturtle,
I can address the reverb.
The delay is only on the last syllable of a section here n there but it's a bit cheesy so I may dump it.
I'm trying to find the right level of reverb for such a sparsely arranged song. I'll post a reverb free version as that may be the best option and take advice from there.

[Tadpui]

Nice job @rayc and @Alison. I like the reverb in some spots, and it sounds like too much in other spots. I'm not sure what the fix is there other than just turning down or automating the reverb mix. Maybe a shorter tail? I dunno. Otherwise the mix sounds good to my ears.

Great vocals on this one. Love the harmonies. And the lyrics are very good as well. The guitar noodling gets a little overbearing during the verses, but the solo is nice. The vibes plus the guitar tone give it a definite 80s sound.

There's some sort of hiccup right before the end of the song. Not sure if that's in the edit or if the render got a little wonky.

[rayc]

Nice job @rayc and @Alison. I like the reverb in some spots, and it sounds like too much in other spots. I'm not sure what the fix is there other than just turning down or automating the reverb mix. Maybe a shorter tail? I dunno. Otherwise the mix sounds good to my ears.

Great vocals on this one. Love the harmonies. And the lyrics are very good as well. The guitar noodling gets a little overbearing during the verses, but the solo is nice. The vibes plus the guitar tone give it a definite 80s sound.

There's some sort of hiccup right before the end of the song. Not sure if that's in the edit or if the render got a little wonky.

Thanks tad,
I've dialled back the guitar behind the vocals - I felt the same way - but as the guitar was the focus of the original instrumental version I want to maintain its presence without it getting in the way.
Try the two reverb addressing versions in the OP and let me know what you think.
The ending - yeah and abrupt change. It was like that in the original. BIAB automatically applies a two bar tag to a song unless told not too. I'm not a fan and will try to get Alan to tweak it.

[Tadpui]

@rayc I'm torn on the reverb thing. Listening to the tiny verb version and at first it really sounded too dry. But as the song goes on it seems more natural. I think it's the contrast of the vocal being so much drier than anything else in the mix. I'm not sure which way to go on this one.

[rayc]

@rayc I'm torn on the reverb thing. Listening to the tiny verb version and at first it really sounded too dry. But as the song goes on it seems more natural. I think it's the contrast of the vocal being so much drier than anything else in the mix. I'm not sure which way to go on this one.

Thanks Tad,
I'm in no hurry...Alison can't comment much given her current circumstances and Alan is out of the loop at the moment too.
I'll have a crack at a dry mix too.

[rayc]

Completely dry mix and a mix with common reverb & amount.

[CeeBee]

The vocals on the last one are perfect, the guitar is a bit quiet for my taste. A great song and great vocals from Alison.

[vomitHatSteve]

Jumping in on "All Night Tears same amount verb.mp"

I like the synth/organ tone you have going on here. (or whatever the lo-fi bell sounding kind of instrument is)

The automation on the guitar around 0:34 is probably too abrupt

The harmonies sound really nice.

Comparing it to the early high-verb version, I think I do like the dryer sound better. I wonder about putting it on an album tho. You tend to have your own voice pretty wet and affected. Will it sound weird to have one song with such dry vocals?

[rayc]

Thanks @CeeBee,
I'm still juggling it...I'll get there eventually.
Thanks @vomitHatSteve,
It's a midi version of a Rhodes piano - nice. I actually owned one. Small, compact & weighed a ton.
0.34 - I'm aware of - it's annoying.
I'd have to do an album of atypical songs wouldn't I.

[Alison]

Sorry, I've been MIA on this. Once the shock wore off, the pain set in. . . ugh!
Anyway, I have listened to the last mix and like it quite a bit! The vocals are upfront much better! The end is still a bit awkward though and I know there is not much you can do about it. Any chance you could take a section from the guitar (like a ringing chord) from earlier on and edit it in so it's not so abrupt? Or maybe just have the drums and bass in there? This may be the drugs talking, lol!!
Really am honored to have worked on this song, @rayc, thank you for asking me!

[rayc]

The end is still a bit awkward though and I know there is not much you can do about it. Any chance you could take a section from the guitar (like a ringing chord) from earlier on and edit it in so it's not so abrupt? Or maybe just have the drums and bass in there? This may be the drugs talking, lol!!

ALL are good ideas Alison.
I've been working at it carefully & slowly so as to minimize upset the original.
It'll have to be something & I'll spend more time on that aspects today.
You do a grand job on this Alison - you make the song real with a good melody and excellent vocals.
Thank You.

[JD01]

I'm coming in on the latest version of this. Sounds pretty authentic 80s blues - like a Robert Cray song or something.
Alison's vocal sounds great, some of the guitar playing is bit overwrought. Could really do with just stabbing some chords while Alison is singing.
That being said, the tone is pretty tidy. Nothing wrong with the mix.

[Lt. Bob]

thoughts on 'verb.
Unless it's a effect, you should never actually 'hear' it ..... you're trying to recreate a space and let's say you go into the big office and chat with someone ...... unless it's a gym you never notice the larger ambience of the larger office ....... it's just there. Yes, if you clapped your hands listening for that specific thing you could tell, but in normal life you don't notice it.

So in a mix if you actually 'notice' the verb as a thing ..... then it's usually too loud.

[TripleM]

I listened to the "All Night Tears same amount verb" version.

Nice vibe to the song.

Love the guitar on the left. Cool part and it sounds nice. Balanced well with the keys.

Good vocal. Maybe just a little forward in the mix. You could could probably back it down a db or so.

Drums sound pretty nice. Really like the thump of the kick.

It's a little light in the low end. You could probably turn up the bass. Maybe the kick too if you're able.

Nice collab.

[rayc]

I listened to the "All Night Tears same amount verb" version.

Nice vibe to the song.

Love the guitar on the left. Cool part and it sounds nice. Balanced well with the keys.

Good vocal. Maybe just a little forward in the mix. You could could probably back it down a db or so.

Drums sound pretty nice. Really like the thump of the kick.

It's a little light in the low end. You could probably turn up the bass. Maybe the kick too if you're able.

Nice collab.

Thanks,
tweaker as per...

[TripleM]

I think you addressed things very well. Sounds nice.

[rayc]

I think you addressed things very well. Sounds nice.

Ta,since there're no additional comments I might call this one sorted subject to @Alison's approval.