Teaching Kids

[JD01]

Anyone taught any young kids to play the guitar? Specifically, does anyone think "handedness" matters?
Can you just decide someone is going to learn right handed even though they're pretty clearly a lefty? Is this likely to hold them back at all?

[Greg_L]

Handedness matters because almost all guitars are made for right handed people.

I've told this story before....I'm right handed but I wanted to play left handed when I first picked up a guitar. My natural inclination was to strum left, fret right. I had a right handed acoustic guitar and tried to learn how to play it left handed. One of my dad's friends, who could play guitar, saw me fumbling around with this setup and he told me to "play the guitar the right way"! And by "right way" he meant right handed. He had me flip the guitar over, he showed me a few cowboy chords and how to tune it, and then I trained myself to play right handed. I'm now a right handed master shredder extraordinaire. So in my opinion, if someone doesn't know anything about playing and is uncomfortable no matter what, then you can mold and force them into playing any way you want. They can learn whichever way they're taught.

But then again, there's @WhiskeyJack who plays upside down left handed on right handed guitars, so whatever.

[CrowsofFritz]

I’m ambidextrous, but naturally inclined to play guitar right handed. I guess I was lucky regarding that. I think anyone with a sliver of natural talent can switch sides.

[Greg_L]

I know of a guy that plays both ways live. He's the "Paul" in a Beatles tribute band. When doing Beatles songs he plays a Hofner Beatle bass left handed and sings. When they play Wings or some other 60s covers he plays a different bass right handed. He's a very talented guy and he doesn't like it when I ask him why he's wasting his talent doing stupid covers.

[WhiskeyJack]

if someone doesn't know anything about playing and is uncomfortable no matter what, then you can mold and force them into playing any way you want. They can learn whichever way they're taught.

Yea I'd agree with this. I know plenty of lefty's that play "the right way" Chris Cresswell of the Flatliners is like this. If you just learn the right way right out of the gates then whatever. It'll be fine. I got started later in life early mid teens and I genuinely just didn't feel comfortable playing the right way. to the point that if that was going to be the way that i "had" to play I just wasn't going to do it because it didn't feel natural or comfortable to me. Maybe if i got into it way way earlier and my mom and dad could afford lessons my story have a different ending.

Is this likely to hold them back at all?

It will only hold them back if they are clearly uncomfortable and things appear unnatural and seem to struggle with things. then the instructor should be observant enough that note that something could be wrong and to try a left handed instrument. Definitely don't do the upside down thing. that is limiting and i can speak to that with experience. I can't shred and power solo. I can play a nice melodic lead half decent, but shredding up the neck isn't a thing. it sounds messy. Another argument there is that one could say i never practiced enough. Additionally where it could get limiting as well if if you "relented" and let this kid play left handed they could get discouraged with the lack of choice for instruments for them in shops. that will be unfun.

I am likely going to tap out of this thread after this post because i know exactly where this is headed but for all it's worth i get incredibly frosty hearing about forcing righthandedness on kids and For anything when they clearly display to the world they are left hand dominant. It's just a hand. The forcing is a thing. I went thru it myself and i have seen other people try to do it with their kids having "only their best interest at heart" Why is being right handed in anyone best interest? I'd love an explanation as to why that doesn't include "becasue XX% of the world is deigned for right handed people" that is complete and utter bullshit kindly go fuck yourself if you think this and maybe accept that some people are individuals and march to their own left handed drum. lol. get fucked.

My origin story for my incredibly hair bristleyness to this is i came in on the very very tail end in rural Canada where left handed kids were treated like "special ed" kids. My grade Six teacher took a huge exception to left handed kids and we were sat in our set aside spot in the class room in our aisle way from the rest of the class, we were given this fucking stupid contraption made of metal bracelets and rings and small bungee cords to put on our hand to crank our left hand around in such a way that our cursive looked more "right handed" basically it folded our hand into the inside of our arm and we were then expected to be comfortable enough to write cursive. And if we got below a certain mark on tests (all the time, she failed all four of us all the time) we were taken aside for an hour a day and had to write "lines" in cursive.... with our right hand.

This did not go over well with parents when they found out but I'll save that story for another day. that's all i really have to say about it.

Alternately @JD01 for your consideration, You wouldn't force a kid to switch his stance on a snowboard, skateboard or surfboard? Would it be limiting for a kid to surf goofy instead of regular? Would you try to correct it? Would you consider someone who surfed opposite stance of you to be limited to any degree? Would you understand that it isn't and it's just a mirror of the "right way"

At the end of the day and after having gone off on that tirade, if you can catch them early enough in sponge phase of their life they will be none the wiser of you get them going right handed while everything in life is new and awkward.

[JD01]

if someone doesn't know anything about playing and is uncomfortable no matter what, then you can mold and force them into playing any way you want. They can learn whichever way they're taught.

Yea I'd agree with this. I know plenty of lefty's that play "the right way" Chris Cresswell of the Flatliners is like this. If you just learn the right way right out of the gates then whatever. It'll be fine. I got started later in life early mid teens and I genuinely just didn't feel comfortable playing the right way. to the point that if that was going to be the way that i "had" to play I just wasn't going to do it because it didn't feel natural or comfortable to me. Maybe if i got into it way way earlier and my mom and dad could afford lessons my story have a different ending.

Is this likely to hold them back at all?

It will only hold them back if they are clearly uncomfortable and things appear unnatural and seem to struggle with things. then the instructor should be observant enough that note that something could be wrong and to try a left handed instrument. Definitely don't do the upside down thing. that is limiting and i can speak to that with experience. I can't shred and power solo. I can play a nice melodic lead half decent, but shredding up the neck isn't a thing. it sounds messy. Another argument there is that one could say i never practiced enough. Additionally where it could get limiting as well if if you "relented" and let this kid play left handed they could get discouraged with the lack of choice for instruments for them in shops. that will be unfun.

I am likely going to tap out of this thread after this post because i know exactly where this is headed but for all it's worth i get incredibly frosty hearing about forcing righthandedness on kids and For anything when they clearly display to the world they are left hand dominant. It's just a hand. The forcing is a thing. I went thru it myself and i have seen other people try to do it with their kids having "only their best interest at heart" Why is being right handed in anyone best interest? I'd love an explanation as to why that doesn't include "becasue XX% of the world is deigned for right handed people" that is complete and utter bullshit kindly go fuck yourself if you think this and maybe accept that some people are individuals and march to their own left handed drum. lol. get fucked.

My origin story for my incredibly hair bristleyness to this is i came in on the very very tail end in rural Canada where left handed kids were treated like "special ed" kids. My grade Six teacher took a huge exception to left handed kids and we were sat in our set aside spot in the class room in our aisle way from the rest of the class, we were given this fucking stupid contraption made of metal bracelets and rings and small bungee cords to put on our hand to crank our left hand around in such a way that our cursive looked more "right handed" basically it folded our hand into the inside of our arm and we were then expected to be comfortable enough to write cursive. And if we got below a certain mark on tests (all the time, she failed all four of us all the time) we were taken aside for an hour a day and had to write "lines" in cursive.... with our right hand.

This did not go over well with parents when they found out but I'll save that story for another day. that's all i really have to say about it.

Alternately @JD01 for your consideration, You wouldn't force a kid to switch his stance on a snowboard, skateboard or surfboard? Would it be limiting for a kid to surf goofy instead of regular? Would you try to correct it? Would you consider someone who surfed opposite stance of you to be limited to any degree? Would you understand that it isn't and it's just a mirror of the "right way"

At the end of the day and after having gone off on that tirade, if you can catch them early enough in sponge phase of their life they will be none the wiser of you get them going right handed while everything in life is new and awkward.

Fuck-a-duck, Shan. That school sounds awful.
Just asking 'cos I've got a houseful of right handed instruments. I don't mind getting a few beginner quality left handed instruments if there's a benefit... But not if its pointless.

[CrowsofFritz]

I know of a guy that plays both ways live. He's the "Paul" in a Beatles tribute band. When doing Beatles songs he plays a Hofner Beatle bass left handed and sings. When they play Wings or some other 60s covers he plays a different bass right handed. He's a very talented guy and he doesn't like it when I ask him why he's wasting his talent doing stupid covers.

Yep, I debated writing about that very guy in my last comment. Glad you brought him up. He has a lot more than “a sliver of talent,” that I mentioned in my comment, but if you start out learning the way that makes you uncomfortable, it will soon be comfortable. My brother became a switch hitter in baseball. Was hard at first but eventually he was better as a left handed hitter than a right handed one.

[WhiskeyJack]

Fuck-a-duck, Shan. That school sounds awful.
Just asking 'cos I've got a houseful of right handed instruments. I don't mind getting a few beginner quality left handed instruments if there's a benefit... But not if its pointless.

Wasn't so much as the school but a few educators. every school had a few of those old school shitty teachers that thought lefties were under the influence of the devil. So gross. When i got to high school i became friends with a guy (another lefty who played "the right way" ) who said his teacher out in the boonies would tie his left hand behind his back to his chair forcing him to use only his right hand only letting him out of his desk for recess and lunches.

fucking hell. I wish i could say i was making this shit up but I am not.

If you are thinking for Bran he's young enough he'll just absorb what dad does you'll be fine.

[Greg_L]

Yep, I debated writing about that very guy in my last comment. Glad you brought him up. He has a lot more than “a sliver of talent,” that I mentioned in my comment, but if you start out learning the way that makes you uncomfortable, it will soon be comfortable. My brother became a switch hitter in baseball. Was hard at first but eventually he was better as a left handed hitter than a right handed one.

Stuff like switch hitting in baseball or skating/surfing "switch" is different though because the tools used in those sports aren't made to go a certain way. A skateboard is a skateboard. A baseball bat is a baseball bat. They can be used either way by anyone. No one switch pitches or switch throws though. Switch hitting baseball players are still right or left hand dominant when catching and throwing. A lot of skateboarders are so good at switch skating that you can't tell what their natural regular stance is. I'm not one of those guys, but they're out there. A skateboard can be skated the same no matter which foot you put in front and back. The skateboard does not dictate which way you stand.

A guitar is different though, if we're talking about teaching and playing in a traditional sense. Guitars are built and strung to be played with a certain handedness, and chord shapes and charts are made to apply to traditional technique. Of course they can be played upside down, and played very well upside down, but should anyone be taught that way? I don't think so. If you're a teacher with a blank canvas then teach the student to play whatever guitar they have.

[WhiskeyJack]

Right handed Guitars are built and strung to be played with a certain handedness,

Left handed Guitars are built and strung to be played with a certain handedness,

fify.

[Armistice]

Do they make left and right hand versions of any other instruments? Serious question - I don't actually know.

I mean, your handedness isn't a question if you want to play piano, or many other instruments - but not many instruments, apart from those with strings, have distinctly different functions for the two hands - be interested to know if the orchestral string instruments come in left/right hand versions.

What about things like trumpets, and other brass and woodwinds? Do they cater for lefties?

Guitar choice will certainly be easier if you're right handed, but if you force someone down that path and they end up being less accomplished, it's not really a good outcome.

I've always thought it odd that right handed people play right handed guitars - the left hand functions are probably more complex than the right hand functions, so riddle me that...

[Greg_L]

Right handed Guitars are built and strung to be played with a certain handedness,

Left handed Guitars are built and strung to be played with a certain handedness,

fify.

Yeah and that's why I said "teach the student to play whatever guitar they have."

[Greg_L]

I've always thought it odd that right handed people play right handed guitars - the left hand functions are probably more complex than the right hand functions, so riddle me that...

That's exactly why I, as a right handed person, tried to play guitar left handed at first. It seemed like my dominant hand should be doing the fine motor skill trickery, which mostly is fretting. It only makes sense.

[rayc]

A special arrangement for seating is pretty common. I frequently had requests from a lefty & righty sitting side by side to swap places. The natural spread of elbows and hands when people write means they need to ensure that elbows aren't in faces. Placing a lefty beside a righty meant ensuring that, the L was stage L. Placing a L on the stage L end of a row worked well too. Beyond that intervention isn't allowed in Australian Public Schools. We weren't even supposed to adjust a student's pencil/pen grip.
Watch what the child does with L & R hands...if there's a dominant one then things are relatively straight forward - teach to the dominant. If not give 'em a cricket bat or tennis racket and see what they do. BIG decider - scissors!

[JD01]

@Armistice I'm pretty sure violins/violas etc come in lefty versions. I don't think brass does though. That being said, the level of conformity in classical training... you rarely see leftys sitting in orchestras.

It's been pretty obvious since Bran was 1, he's 3 now (and wanting to play guitar) that he's very left hand dominant

[Armistice]

GF is a lefty, and I completely forget until I see her write ... she doesn't really have any interests where hand dominance enters into it. Although, I seem to recall, years ago, when playing tennis, she played right handed.

[Armistice]

@Armistice I'm pretty sure violins/violas etc come in lefty versions. I don't think brass does though. That being said, the level of conformity in classical training... you rarely see leftys sitting in orchestras.

It's been pretty obvious since Bran was 1, he's 3 now (and wanting to play guitar) that he's very left hand dominant

We can never be sure until puberty...

[JD01]

GF is a lefty, and I completely forget until I see her write ... she doesn't really have any interests where hand dominance enters into it. Although, I seem to recall, years ago, when playing tennis, she played right handed.

Hand dominance can be weird in sport. There's a lot of boxers that work on being a southpaw 'cos it gives them a natural advantages... if you've ever boxed you'll realise how much of a pain in the arse it it boxing against lefties, which is why they're so over-represented in lists of champions. (except oddly, at heavyweight). One of the greats, I think it was Sugar Ray Robinson, was a natural lefty, but boxed orthodox which gave him a naturally very powerful jab which even occasionally was used for knockouts.

There's loads of cases of right handers that are left footers.

I think when a kid does nearly everything, eats, drinks, throws a ball, pushes toy cars etc with his left hand you can be pretty sure he's one of Shan's lot.

We can never be sure until puberty...

haha, you've really got a bee in your bonnet about that.

[Armistice]

haha, you've really got a bee in your bonnet about that.

Trust me, I don't.

I've never boxed - slamming my hands repeatedly into hard surfaces like someone else's face never seemed like a good choice for a guitar player. Long skinny hands and fingers and arms ... not really built for it either.

[vomitHatSteve]

@Armistice I'm pretty sure violins/violas etc come in lefty versions. I don't think brass does though. That being said, the level of conformity in classical training... you rarely see leftys sitting in orchestras.

I think the logistics of arranging those folks with bows makes sitting lefty players in an orchestra pretty tricky

The actual dexterity required for brass is pretty minimal (3 valves), and i suspect it's pretty symmetrical for woodwinds; so handedness isn't a huge deal for those instruments