BIAB SongS - A place to demonstrate the good and the bad of BIAB

[CeeBee]

I hear the brush around then.
My trad. brain is confused by the brushed snare over to the right.
What instruments are in the mix [mention]CeeBee[/mention] ?
I hear drums, but they are oddly panned, pedal steel, an acoustic, bass (is that a little left leaning too?), lead guitar (Tele?).
What's you & what's BIAB?
COOL country song for certain.
Good vocal for the song too.
A little essing to control and possibly sorting out that noise floor if it's there.

My progressive jamstix (all over the place ) strikes again. I revisited the mix and saw that the jamstix outputs were panned in a rather strange non drummer (me) fashion. I really must get to grips with that program. Also saw that i have three acoustic guitars and one electric guitar from BiaB, which is probably a bit much. You're correct, the bass is panned to the left slightly. BiaB provided the pedal steel, the E-Bass, piano, acoustic guitars, and electric guitar. Lead guitar and vocals by me. I can't remember if the lead guitar is my home made tele or my Ibanez semi-hollow. The problem with me and BiaB is that I generate too many tracks with no real plan, and then put too many into a song. I'll get rid of jamstix and some of the guitars and see what happens.

In 2Angels

There does seem to be a rough edit in the cello at one point but you can treat that with a bit of delay or a cut & paste.

Can you give me the approximate time please.

[rayc]

CeeBee- 2.33 is the spot.
There's a fair bit of "mouth" noise in the track too - the natural squeaks and splats that come from moisture and lack of it etc. They could be edited out, reduced in level or a gate put, carefully, on the track.
When singing Let Me know you have a Richard Hawley touch/sound that is quite nice.

[rayc]

The problem with me and BiaB is that I generate too many tracks with no real plan, and then put too many into a song. I'll get rid of jamstix and some of the guitars and see what happens.

Yes, too many options available - I'm like that when recording my own stuff. I have an idea, record it and am loathe to dump it so it ends up in the mix.
I need to be told & often.
Open your project, mute the vox & your lead, pan everything to centre (turn off any stereo effects) and go through the song muting different instruments and parts. you'll soon get the sense of what's essential. Mute what isn't, bring back the vox & lead then pan what you have to get a pleasant stereo spread.
It's what I do when I remember to. Sometimes the rush of blood to the head won't allow me to though.

[CeeBee]

Sorry for the delay in replying, I was going to post a new version of "Let me Know" with a few instruments removed, but was interrupted by a heart attack. I've been in hospital for the last week and was released this morning with three stents and a load of holes from the blood tests. I'll see if I can find the version and post it. I really appreciate the feedback on my tracks as I would like to get them as polished as possible without having to re-record too much.

[rayc]

CeeBee,
Some interruption!
You write like you're in a good place - that's cool.
Take care mate.

[rayc]

I was a bit worried about not having anything up my sleeve for a new track so went downstairs, plugged my Mustang into my Marshall at a clean volume and added my little spring reverb pedal.
I came up with something not a million miles from my last track - spring reverb, clean tones, arpeggios etc.
I created a structure in BIAB so I'd have a drum track to work with but also decided to add bass, organ a 12 string and an acoustic guitar as they were the instruments I contemplated using given the initial sounds.
I fiddled about with the structure and chord sequence/progression while I was in there and tried to make the changes from one section to the next gentler in terms of chords but not tone.
With those in Reaper I added a couple of tracks of guitar and then some extras to the M8.
I was going to run with the organ as M8 for the time being/gap filler but it lacked the feel of the reverb guitar so I generated a Baritone guitar solo in BIAB as well.
I've played with the arrangement & dynamics and think this might do for a next project. starting point.
I'll replace the bass, acoustic & 12 string tracks over the next week or so I hope & then comes to terms, after a week or so of practice, with the F shape arpeggios.
Thoughts?

Late October27.mp3

[CeeBee]

Sounds good for the start of a project, I like the way you approach these songs. They build up very nicely from a humble beginning something swanlike, from a cygnet to the fully fledged beast..

[CeeBee]

I replaced the Jamstix drums with the original BiaB Realdrums and tarted them up a bit with a parallel compressor on a high ratio, got rid of some electric and acoustic guitars and remixed it a bit.
I think I'll leave it at that

LetMeKnowMix3.mp3

[rayc]

CeeBee,
That's a better sound - more space more balance and clearer image.
Your voice suits it really well.
There's some sibilance though - made more obvious becasue of the intimate & upfront voice.
Treating it can be done with a plug in, (often not very useful) or some manual work.
At 2.38 is that an edit point or something else?

[rayc]

I had the chance to work on my latest this morning. I've replaced the acoustic guitar with my 12 string and recorded a bass track. The bass took me yonks as I hadn't played the song through on it - I finally twisted my head around the middle eight so knocked something half useful together.
Still BIAB drums, organ and a 12 string electric - I kept the electric 12 becasue it plays some varied shapes over the chorus that I've not yet attempted to replicate.
I've also sort a lyroc and done a "phrasing" track - I can't sing but it's given me a start for getting a vocalist.
Just the backing

Late October3.mp3

Backing with lyrics.

Late October2lyrc.mp3

& the lyrics - a bit dark but that's fine by me...
The Narcissist's Wife

The man who keeps his powder dry
And neither smokes nor drinks
Will have you plead for hard relief
With just the way he thinks.

The narcissist’s wife.
She
She lives alone
Despite his presence in the house
His word
Cuts like a knife
Despite his calm
She
Knows he isn’t
Cut close to the life
Of the narcissist’s wife

His foreplay has been perfected
Scripted blow by blow
Each moan or cry in place
The wife tells friends it’s so.
Each moan or cry
The wife tells friends it’s so

The narcissist’s wife.
She
She lives alone
Despite his presence in the house
Always
Plays the jack-knife
Despite his charm
She
Knows he hasn’t
Cut close to the life
Of the narcissist’s wife

The narcissist’s wife.
She
She lives alone
Despite his presence in the house
His word
Cuts like a knife
Despite his harm
She
Knows he means it
Cut close to the life
Of the narcissist’s wife

The calm impassive voice
Of a man who wields power
Who knows he can make you
Never to have existed
Within the subsequent hour.
Never to have existed

Cut so keenly close to life
With just the way he thinks

[CeeBee]

Sounds a bit like an Ode to Melania Nice and dark, keep it up, I look forward to the end result.

[rayc]

Ode to Melania

LOVE it.

[rayc]

Here's the latest mix - I've replaced all the BIAB elements except for drums, organ & solo - the solo will go eventually.
BIAB keeps telling me that 19% of the chords are complex - there are two minor chords and a couple of flat chords but nothing actually complex. The BIAB 12 string electric played some very odd extensions over Em - actually discordant but not in a tension or useful way.

Late October4.mp3

[rayc]

Only Drums & Organ BIAB elements left.
I re-tracked the spangly arpeggio parts as well - I swapped guitars a couple of times to find ones where I didn't cramp too much. My Teleclone seemed to work well & my Guyatone 125T was great to play but I realize now that the root note pops up too much with it as I had set controls.
I'll have to get someone to do a real solo and re track at least one apr. guitar.

Late October7.mp3

[WhiskeyJack]

I replaced the Jamstix drums with the original BiaB Realdrums and tarted them up a bit with a parallel compressor on a high ratio, got rid of some electric and acoustic guitars and remixed it a bit.
I think I'll leave it at that

LetMeKnowMix3.mp3

This is pretty good CeeBee. One of the finer attempts from biaB i have heard. I do notice that there is a little clipping or frying or something going on in the vocal tracks. you will hear it at 0:12 on "if you Ever" and the next instance i caught was 0:32 "if you EVer chnage your mind"

There are a few more instances of this but if you decide to go looking and try to get it sorted chances are it will cure all the instances of it. I want to say it might be something to do with any compression you have going on there, but i can't say for certain.

Great vocal performance.

[mention]rayc[/mention] how does BiaB handle all it's plugs, there is some noticeable hissing in CeeBee's song here when his vocal lines trail out and then vanish as though there may be a gate or something on the vocal tracks with some really heavy compression?

[WhiskeyJack]

Only Drums & Organ BIAB elements left.
I re-tracked the spangly arpeggio parts as well - I swapped guitars a couple of times to find ones where I didn't cramp too much. My Teleclone seemed to work well & my Guyatone 125T was great to play but I realize now that the root note pops up too much with it as I had set controls.
I'll have to get someone to do a real solo and re track at least one apr. guitar.
Late October7.mp3

This sounds pretty good Ray! I was going to say i feel like the drums could come up in the mix as the guitars are really dominant but then i turned the volume up on my end and it almost fixed the problem. It sounds really cool.

I have been noticing the monitoring knob on my 18i20 responds kind of funny to stuff. you almost need ot have it set at 12oclock position while mixing. Something really weird going on there. But that is my issue to sort out on my end.

So is your Guyatone the guitar i hear enter this song around the 2:30 mark? That guitar sounds really good man!! Whatever it is?

[CeeBee]

[mention]WhiskeyJack[/mention] Thanks for you comments WJ, much appreciated. These tracks are pretty old and have been mixed and treated with some stuff I cannot remember, so there are likely to be hissing etc. in there somewhere. Thanks for pinpointing them, I'm in rehab after my heart attack at the moment but I'll take another look at the track when I get back. BiaB will only take 32bit plugins, but that shouldn't have much effect.

[WhiskeyJack]

@WhiskeyJack Thanks for you comments WJ, much appreciated. These tracks are pretty old and have been mixed and treated with some stuff I cannot remember, so there are likely to be hissing etc. in there somewhere. Thanks for pinpointing them, I'm in rehab after my heart attack at the moment but I'll take another look at the track when I get back. BiaB will only take 32bit plugins, but that shouldn't have much effect.

jesus! heart Attack! Man get rested and take care of yourself ! Glad you made it out o.k.

[rayc]

@rayc how does BiaB handle all it's plugs, there is some noticeable hissing in CeeBee's song here when his vocal lines trail out and then vanish as though there may be a gate or something on the vocal tracks with some really heavy compression?

BIAB supposedly handles 32 bit plugs and should manage 64 but I don't use any in that environment. RealBand is the DAW written to accompany BIAB but I've not bothered with it as Reaper is a squillion times better.
Plug ins have no trouble with BIAB origin.wav files at all .
@CeeBee
If you'd like me to have a crack at de-essing and tidying your vocal track send me the .wav file/files via a download link or similar.

[CeeBee]

[mention]rayc[/mention] Ray, that's avery gentlemanly offer which I will take up This song is from 2004 and has been tweaked many times resulting in the fact that the only vocal track I like has some drum beat permanently mixed into it .
That is not a problem in the mix because they are very quiet, and they tend to line up with the drums. The other vocal tracks are either pitchy or lacking in emotion. I've linked it to dropbox where you can download it as it is a bit large.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/dnejel4ylkqog ... 1.wav?dl=0