The Tone Thread

[Greg_L]

Lol, yeah miner. Some of those are nice, some are too thin for me. I think I like #2 the best.

The full effects cockrock clip is just about right though.

[Minerman]

Thanks dudes, I was wondering if anyone was gonna reply or not...

Some of the tones I posted are thin, but all of 'em are a bit different, & the only thing actually different are the bright switches...

I've learned the amp a lot better, Gain 2 fattens the tone up, for the most part...Gain 1 does to a point, but it's not as much/dramatic as Gain 2...

Using more Gain 2 will give an old-school type dirt sound, very much like Hendrix...It's dirty, with a loose, flabby sounding bottom end to it, kinda fuzz-like...Using more Gain 1 will give more of the dirt sound I'd expect, tighter bottom end & more focused...

But, by using the bright switches, the gain structure can be changed completely, & the effect of the bright switch is way more noticeable when the corresponding gain knob is lowered...

I'm still really surprised how many different sounds this amp is capable of...When I had it the first time 'round, I was so floored by the high-gain tones, that's all I used it for...
But this time 'round, I can honestly say I've found "the" amp for me...

[Greg_L]

Thanks dudes, I was wondering if anyone was gonna reply or not...

Some of the tones I posted are thin, but all of 'em are a bit different, & the only thing actually different are the bright switches...

I've learned the amp a lot better, Gain 2 fattens the tone up, for the most part...Gain 1 does to a point, but it's not as much/dramatic as Gain 2...

Using more Gain 2 will give an old-school type dirt sound, very much like Hendrix...It's dirty, with a loose, flabby sounding bottom end to it, kinda fuzz-like...Using more Gain 1 will give more of the dirt sound I'd expect, tighter bottom end & more focused...

But, by using the bright switches, the gain structure can be changed completely, & the effect of the bright switch is way more noticeable when the corresponding gain knob is lowered...

I'm still really surprised how many different sounds this amp is capable of...When I had it the first time 'round, I was so floored by the high-gain tones, that's all I used it for...
But this time 'round, I can honestly say I've found "the" amp for me...

I'm looking at a layout for the Chupa. It looks to me like the second gain really is just a continuation of the first gain. There is a lot of low end cutting and grid stopping resistance going on - this will juice the gain. The bright switches cut low end on each stage. They're essentially switchable bright caps on the gain pots. The era switch engages diodes or LEDs...can't tell which, but it looks like some extra SS clipping added to the first gain stage of V2. Then it's on to a standard tone stack and phase inverter. Pretty cool. They get a lot of gain out of a basic tube layout.

[Minerman]

I'm looking at a layout for the Chupa. It looks to me like the second gain really is just a continuation of the first gain. There is a lot of low end cutting and grid stopping resistance going on - this will juice the gain. The bright switches cut low end on each stage. They're essentially switchable bright caps on the gain pots. The era switch engages diodes or LEDs...can't tell which, but it looks like some extra SS clipping added to the first gain stage of V2. Then it's on to a standard tone stack and phase inverter. Pretty cool. They get a lot of gain out of a basic tube layout.

All that is pretty much over my head, as far as schematic/wiring...

This is from the manual:

• <sup>GAIN 2 adjusts the signal strength coming out of the second gain stage, and going into the third tube stage. Think of this as a “saturation” control that will impact pick attack, compression, and feel. Depending on the BRIGHT 2 setting, you can also use this to shape the high and low frequency response of your Chupacabra.
  
  BRIGHT 2 is a high-frequency boost that can be used to add sparkle and gain to your tone. In the middle position, BRIGHT 2 is defeated. In the left position, it boosts upper mid and high frequencies, and adds noticeable gain. With the toggle switch in the right position, it boosts extreme high frequencies, and adds less gain boost than the left position. In conjunction with an active Bright 2, lower GAIN 2 settings will also trim the bottom end. This high frequency boost / low frequency cut is more prominent as GAIN 2 is turned down.
  
  GAIN 1 adjusts the signal strength coming out of the first gain stage, and going into the second tube stage. Think of this as a global “gain” control. Depending on the BRIGHT 1 setting, you can also use this to shape the high and low frequency response of your Chupacabra.
  
  BRIGHT 1 is a high-frequency boost that can be used to add sparkle and gain to your tone. In the middle position, BRIGHT 1 is defeated. In the left position, it boosts upper mid and high frequencies, and adds noticeable gain. With the toggle switch in the right position, it boosts extreme high frequencies, and adds less gain boost than the right position. In conjunction with an active Bright 1, lower GAIN 1 settings will also trim the bottom end. This high frequency boost / low frequency cut is more prominent as GAIN 2 is turned down.</sup>

I'd say you're pretty spot-on about what's going on with the technical thing dude...

I'm gonna bet if/when you build one, it'd be a killer...I'm also gonna bet the volume drop won't be as drastic so you could gig with it...Am I pretty close to what you're thinking on a build if it happens???

[Greg_L]

All that is pretty much over my head, as far as schematic/wiring...

This is from the manual:

• <sup>GAIN 2 adjusts the signal strength coming out of the second gain stage, and going into the third tube stage. Think of this as a “saturation” control that will impact pick attack, compression, and feel. Depending on the BRIGHT 2 setting, you can also use this to shape the high and low frequency response of your Chupacabra.
  
  BRIGHT 2 is a high-frequency boost that can be used to add sparkle and gain to your tone. In the middle position, BRIGHT 2 is defeated. In the left position, it boosts upper mid and high frequencies, and adds noticeable gain. With the toggle switch in the right position, it boosts extreme high frequencies, and adds less gain boost than the left position. In conjunction with an active Bright 2, lower GAIN 2 settings will also trim the bottom end. This high frequency boost / low frequency cut is more prominent as GAIN 2 is turned down.
  
  GAIN 1 adjusts the signal strength coming out of the first gain stage, and going into the second tube stage. Think of this as a global “gain” control. Depending on the BRIGHT 1 setting, you can also use this to shape the high and low frequency response of your Chupacabra.
  
  BRIGHT 1 is a high-frequency boost that can be used to add sparkle and gain to your tone. In the middle position, BRIGHT 1 is defeated. In the left position, it boosts upper mid and high frequencies, and adds noticeable gain. With the toggle switch in the right position, it boosts extreme high frequencies, and adds less gain boost than the right position. In conjunction with an active Bright 1, lower GAIN 1 settings will also trim the bottom end. This high frequency boost / low frequency cut is more prominent as GAIN 2 is turned down.</sup>

I'd say you're pretty spot-on about what's going on with the technical thing dude...

Yeah I think I got it right from the schematic....but I don't know about "active" bright switches. They don't seem to be active. They're not boosters - they just cut. Cutting lows will act like boosting highs, but it's not actually boosting. Unless I'm reading it wrong. But I see no evidence that the bright switches are active. They are not mini preamps.

I'm gonna bet if/when you build one, it'd be a killer...I'm also gonna bet the volume drop won't be as drastic so you could gig with it...Am I pretty close to what you're thinking on a build if it happens???

Lol. I really doubt I'll build one. I have no use for an amp like that. I don't know for certain, but now that I can kind of follow what's going on in there, your Chupa seems a lot like it's based pretty closely on the Friedman Brown Eye mod....or in that ballpark. I could actually do all of that to my existing amps if I want to. The basics of your Chupa are in my Plexis. I can cascade a Plexi circuit and add the bypass caps and grid resistors and make my own Chupa for honestly just a few bucks.

[Greg_L]

Chupa50-30Sept-2015.jpg

All that stuff on the right is where the magic happens. But it looks a lot worse than it is. All that extra shit around the tubes is often found on the board itself. On the Chupa they added it to terminal strips. Everything to the left of the "pussy trim" is pretty standard Marshall tone stack and power section.

[Minerman]

Yeah I think I got it right from the schematic....but I don't know about "active" bright switches. They don't seem to be active. They're not boosters - they just cut. Cutting lows will act like boosting highs, but it's not actually boosting. Unless I'm reading it wrong. But I see no evidence that the bright switches are active. They are not mini preamps.

All that just flies way over my head really, but engaging the bright switches adds gain...
Doesn't matter, & it's all voodoo to me, but I sure like it...

Lol. I really doubt I'll build one. I have no use for an amp like that. I don't know for certain, but now that I can kind of follow what's going on in there, your Chupa seems a lot like it's based pretty closely on the Friedman Brown Eye mod....or in that ballpark. I could actually do all of that to my existing amps if I want to. The basics of your Chupa are in my Plexis. I can cascade a Plexi circuit and add the bypass caps and grid resistors and make my own Chupa for honestly just a few bucks.

I thought you might build one that's all gained-up, but without the volume drop...I just assumed that though because that's one of the amps I've heard you actually brag on, which is saying a lot with the stable you have...

I'm thinking about ordering one of those cheap Bugera attenuators in the next little while...I don't really need to do anything but make sure I don't blow a speaker, because with my luck something catastrophic like taking my amp with it could happen...

[Minerman]

All that stuff on the right is where the magic happens. But it looks a lot worse than it is. All that extra shit around the tubes is often found on the board itself. On the Chupa they added it to terminal strips. Everything to the left of the "pussy trim" is pretty standard Marshall tone stack and power section.

Again, all over my head dude...But since you're here & it's on my mind:

Say I have the FSR (force sensing resistor) for my e-kit hi-hat pedal, how would I wire a resistor in series to this???

The blue box is the resistor, would this be right wiring the resistor in series to the FSR???



There are only 2 leads on the fsr, but would this be right, or would I connect both legs of the resistor to one lead or what???

Sorry for the kindergarten drawing btw...

[Greg_L]

All that just flies way over my head really, but engaging the bright switches adds gain...
Doesn't matter, & it's all voodoo to me, but I sure like it...

Yeah it will add gain by cutting low end. But it's not actually "boosting". It's like when you snip the bright cap out of a normal amp. It gets darker and seems less gainy. Put the bright cap back in and it seems like it has more gain. It's brighter and more aggressive when you tailor the low end before it hits the tube. The tube works better without all that low muck fucking it up. The value of the capacitor dictates where the cut off happens. Add a resistor and you have a high pass filter.

I thought you might build one that's all gained-up, but without the volume drop...I just assumed that though because that's one of the amps I've heard you actually brag on, which is saying a lot with the stable you have...

I'd have to know why the volume drops before I can build one without the volume drop. I'm still not sure why the Chupa cuts volume as the gain goes up. I'm starting to wonder if it's maybe in those clipping diodes. They might be taking away so much dynamic range that the signal is just simply smaller and weaker as it passes through the rest of the amp afterwards. It's clipped and gainy, but it's been shrunk. When you use it in basic Plexi mode, it doesn't have as much signal mangling going on, so it can stay beefier as it moves through. I'd have to see it on the scope to know for sure. Something like that would show up easily on a scope.

I'm thinking about ordering one of those cheap Bugera attenuators in the next little while...I don't really need to do anything but make sure I don't blow a speaker, because with my luck something catastrophic like taking my amp with it could happen...

Damn, 99 bucks. That would probably be perfect.

[Greg_L]

Again, all over my head dude...But since you're here & it's on my mind:

Say I have the FSR (force sensing resistor) for my e-kit hi-hat pedal, how would I wire a resistor in series to this???

The blue box is the resistor, would this be right wiring the resistor in series to the FSR???



There are only 2 leads on the fsr, but would this be right, or would I connect both legs of the resistor to one lead or what???

Sorry for the kindergarten drawing btw...

If you want to add a resistor in series, you'd just put the resistor in-line into one of the leads. You'd just have to determine if it needs to be before or after the FSR, or if it even matters.

[Minerman]

Bugera attenuator

Damn, 99 bucks. That would probably be perfect.

Yeah, I've had my heart set on a Weber Mass 200, but it's 3x as much...

If you want to add a resistor in series, you'd just put the resistor in-line into one of the leads. You'd just have to determine if it needs to be before or after the FSR, or if it even matters.

I'll try to explain what I'm after....

The fsr allows all the "in-between" hi-hat articulations with my e-kit/hh pedal...But, it's so sensitive, I can't control it with my foot, it's either full closed or full open...The resistor would (in theory) make the sensor less sensitive, allowing me to find the "in between" hh positions...Does this make sense to you???

[Greg_L]

I'll try to explain what I'm after....

The fsr allows all the "in-between" hi-hat articulations with my e-kit/hh pedal...But, it's so sensitive, I can't control it with my foot, it's either full closed or full open...The resistor would (in theory) make the sensor less sensitive, allowing me to find the "in between" hh positions...Does this make sense to you???

Sure, give it a try. Try to rig it in a way that's temporary just for testing, and if it works, make it permanent.

[Minerman]

Here's a short, shitty clip, amp settings/mic placement:



Signal chain: Strat > EVH Mini > '57

EVH MINI STACK 10-13-2018.mp3

I just slapped this together in about 15 minutes so it's pretty damn sloppy, lemme know what you think.....

[rayc]

Sounds better than a big brother EVH to me.

[JD01]

haha, that doesn't sound too bad at all! Its hopelessly thin, but then it has a 3" speaker.
Your drumming's getting better too, mate (ooo, cowbell!). Is this one of your songs or a cover?

[Greg_L]

It sounds better than I thought it would. It certainly sounds better than the similar micro Marshall.

[Lt. Bob]

actually not too bad sounding

[JD01]

I heard far worse tones... I've recorded far worse tones!

[Minerman]

Thanks dudes, that's one of my originals...Everything (guitar x2, bass, drums) you hear is a first take, I just hit record & ran through it, so it's pretty sloppy...

[JD01]

Cool. You gonna finish this one?