Pickup Query

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JD01
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Pickup Query

Post by JD01 »

Mutt,

Would it be possible to stick traditional single coil in a P90 soap-bar housing?
I like a glassy strat sound in the neck position and don't like a P90s in the neck posistion.
I'd very rarely stick the selector in the middle position, but would this cause a problem?

Also, could I replace the neck humbucker on my custom with a single coil pickup which is sized to fit the SD humbucker sized rout?
You know this guitar currently has a three way selector with coil splits.

If I put a tapable single coil in the neck position would this play nice with the bridge humbucker in the middle position when both are untaped/split and when the humbucker is split and the single coil tapped. (I'm assuming that I'd wire up the tap identically to how I wire up the current splitable humbuckers)
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muttley
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Re: Pickup Query

Post by muttley »

JD01 wrote: Wed Nov 22, 2017 7:42 am Mutt,

Would it be possible to stick traditional single coil in a P90 soap-bar housing?
Anything is "possible". By traditional single coil, which one do you mean? Strat? Which guitar are we talking here? Does it have a bucker route or a p90 route? Custom shops offer a strat in a bucker case or p90 case. I could do that too no problem..

I like a glassy strat sound in the neck position and don't like a P90s in the neck position.
The main difference between a strat pickup and a p90 are; the number of turns on the bobbin, the bobbin shape and the magnets.

A p90 typically has around 9k turns, a strat around 5k. The bobbin on a p90 is wider and flatter (not as deep). The magnets on a p90 are bar magnets and seated under the bobbin with metal pole pieces. On a strat the pole pieces are the magnets. All those things affect how it sounds.

I'd very rarely stick the selector in the middle position, but would this cause a problem?
Depends on what the other pups are. To get the phase and hum-cancelling right you need to get the magnet polarity and wind direction right. Typically to get hum cancelling you need two coils wound opposite ways CCW and CW. You also need to change the magnets to opposite poles to get the phase right. Yes it can be done.
Also, could I replace the neck humbucker on my custom with a single coil pickup which is sized to fit the SD humbucker sized rout?
You know this guitar currently has a three way selector with coil splits.
Yes you could. There are few options off the shelf and it wouldnt be hard to come up with a custom design. There is a lot of room in there to work with. Why not just split the coils on the bucker to single coil?
If I put a tapable single coil in the neck position would this play nice with the bridge humbucker in the middle position when both are untaped/split and when the humbucker is split and the single coil tapped. (I'm assuming that I'd wire up the tap identically to how I wire up the current splitable humbuckers)


As above, it depends how you have the wind and magnets orientated. You would need to know the wind direction and polarity of the humbucker. Not hard to find out. The tap on the coil would make no difference. All a tap does is reduce the number of winds.
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JD01
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Re: Pickup Query

Post by JD01 »

OK, the first query regarding the single coil in the P90 housing would be for my PRS Soapbar. So that's a guitar which came with P90s as stock so is probably set up/routed for P90s. I was just wondering if you could basically have a glassy strat pickup in the neck position which will mount tidily in the P90 rout and end up looking normal without a massive hole around the outside of a tiny traditionally sized single coil.

The 2nd query was regarding my custom. I've never been that that happy with the SD Jazz in the neck position - my FMT tele had a '59 in the neck position which I did like and gave me the stratty sound I was after when it was split.

I could just get a splitable humbucker put in there which you think would do the job and play nicely with my Muttbucker and that would be fine.

But, seeing as I almost never use the neck pickup as a humbucker, I figured it might be more interesting to have a tapable single coil in the neck position - to give myself two tone options on a single coil pickup and also give me the option (which I've not had before) to have a bridge humbucker and single coil in the neck position on at the same time.

Am I making sense yet?
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Re: Pickup Query

Post by muttley »

Ok,

Point 1, putting a strat coil in a p90 cover wouldnt be a problem. The only off the shelf options I know of are SD's and they are way too pricey for what they are. Over a hundred quid. I could do it for less than half that.

On point 2 you have some options as you can either have a strat coil mounted in a humbucker case, get a humbucker and split the coils or look into something along the lines of the Wide Range fender style buckers. I could help you out with any of the above..
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JD01
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Re: Pickup Query

Post by JD01 »

muttley wrote: Wed Nov 22, 2017 12:36 pm Ok,

Point 1, putting a strat coil in a p90 cover wouldnt be a problem. The only off the shelf options I know of are SD's and they are way too pricey for what they are. Over a hundred quid. I could do it for less than half that.

On point 2 you have some options as you can either have a strat coil mounted in a humbucker case, get a humbucker and split the coils or look into something along the lines of the Wide Range fender style buckers. I could help you out with any of the above..
Cheers, but the point is - both sound like relatively sensible ideas that could work and aren't stupid?

I'm pretty sure that I'll definitely modify the PRS pickups as described (If I don't completely destroy it with the reshape and respray).
Haven't decided to whether to go for a tapable single coil or splitable humbucker in my custom yet.

Whatever I chose to do - I'll definitely be asking you first on the pickups. :punk:
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Re: Pickup Query

Post by muttley »

There is no such thing as a bad idea just an idea badly executed..;)
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Re: Pickup Query

Post by Greg_L »

Why do you want to tap a single coil? They're already pretty low output and you can just roll the volume off.
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JD01
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Re: Pickup Query

Post by JD01 »

Greg_L wrote: Wed Nov 22, 2017 9:01 pm Why do you want to tap a single coil? They're already pretty low output and you can just roll the volume off.
Just figured it would be an interesting idea as I almost never use the neck pickup as a humbucker. You're probably right though, having a splitable humbucker in the neck position is probably much more versatile. Just want one that sounds glassy and stratty when split like the SD'59 used to in my old FMT Tele.
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Re: Pickup Query

Post by muttley »

Taping a single coil isnt the same as rolling off the volume. Hopefully soon LT will be able to give us a take on a MuttPup Mutt90 with a coil tap as he has one going in a guitar pretty soon. It has a tap about 20% down from about 8.5k. It wont give a strat like tone and nor will a split humbucker but it will drive the amp differently.

JD, If I have time next week I will see if I can find enough spare parts to knock up a strat coil in humbucker90 case and give it a whirl... I'm doing pups most of next week.
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Re: Pickup Query

Post by JD01 »

muttley wrote: Thu Nov 23, 2017 7:44 am Taping a single coil isnt the same as rolling off the volume. Hopefully soon LT will be able to give us a take on a MuttPup Mutt90 with a coil tap as he has one going in a guitar pretty soon. It has a tap about 20% down from about 8.5k. It wont give a strat like tone and nor will a split humbucker but it will drive the amp differently.

JD, If I have time next week I will see if I can find enough spare parts to knock up a strat coil in humbucker90 case and give it a whirl... I'm doing pups most of next week.
No rush on the pickups for the PRS, mate. I'll probably make sure I'll re-shape and spray the PRS before I go upgrading the pickups. I like the way the guitar feels but I HATE the way it looks. I know that shouldn't matter, but it just doesn't make me want to play it.

Will probably be more sensible to swap out the bridge pickup in my custom first as I know I want that done. In fact, if you've got a bright idea that you think will sit will with my Muttbucker feel free to share it!
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Re: Pickup Query

Post by muttley »

I thought the strat tone in the neck was for the custom? To replace the SD (SH59?)..
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Re: Pickup Query

Post by JD01 »

muttley wrote: Thu Nov 23, 2017 9:06 am I thought the strat tone in the neck was for the custom? To replace the SD (SH59?)..
Yeah - the strat tone in the neck is for the Crimson Custom. At the moment I have a SD Jazz in there which is really dark. My old tele had a '59 which, when split, sounded nice and glassy/stratty. I'd like something similar which will play nice with the Muttbucker in the bridge. So I'm either after a nice splittable neck humbucker or a tapable humbucker sized single coil.

The PRS needs a pair of soapbars. A bridge P90 soapbar, (I love a P90 in the bridge position) and a traditional single coil in the neck but in a soapbar housing.
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Re: Pickup Query

Post by Greg_L »

Dude just split a humbucker for your neck pickup. So simple.
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Re: Pickup Query

Post by muttley »

Greg_L wrote: Thu Nov 23, 2017 10:08 am Dude just split a humbucker for your neck pickup. So simple.
Not all humbucker coils split the same. Depends on the coil and the magnet. To get a more strat like tone you'd want to wind the coil specifically for that.
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Re: Pickup Query

Post by muttley »

JD01 wrote: Thu Nov 23, 2017 9:13 am
muttley wrote: Thu Nov 23, 2017 9:06 am I thought the strat tone in the neck was for the custom? To replace the SD (SH59?)..
Yeah - the strat tone in the neck is for the Crimson Custom. At the moment I have a SD Jazz in there which is really dark. My old tele had a '59 which, when split, sounded nice and glassy/stratty. I'd like something similar which will play nice with the Muttbucker in the bridge. So I'm either after a nice splittable neck humbucker or a tapable humbucker sized single coil.

The PRS needs a pair of soapbars. A bridge P90 soapbar, (I love a P90 in the bridge position) and a traditional single coil in the neck but in a soapbar housing.
OK gottcha..
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Re: Pickup Query

Post by Greg_L »

muttley wrote: Thu Nov 23, 2017 10:16 am

Not all humbucker coils split the same. Depends on the coil and the magnet. To get a more strat like tone you'd want to wind the coil specifically for that.
If you want real Strat tone, use a Strat. But a split bucker in the neck will sound single-coily enough to get by if the pickup and pots are right for the job. Some overwound metal shit pickups don't sound good anyway. A sensible rock and roll neck pickup with *normal* output and magnets should split fine.
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Re: Pickup Query

Post by muttley »

I agree but how you wind the coil does make a differance. If you split an overwound metal pickup it's gonna sound brash and harsh. If you split a lower output pickup it's gonna tend towards thin and reedy.. If you wind a coil and scatter it right you can get that twang and clarity that leans towards a strat. It aint gonna be a strat but it would be closer.
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Re: Pickup Query

Post by Greg_L »

muttley wrote: Thu Nov 23, 2017 11:11 am I agree but how you wind the coil does make a differance. If you split an overwound metal pickup it's gonna sound brash and harsh. If you split a lower output pickup it's gonna tend towards thin and reedy.. If you wind a coil and scatter it right you can get that twang and clarity that leans towards a strat. It aint gonna be a strat but it would be closer.
Right, that's what I was getting at.

There are a few modern Gibson humbuckers that split really well. The 57 and Burstbucker series are really good when split...they're also pretty mild output and some of them are scatter-wound.

I'm NOT suggesting J buy a Gibson pup. Lol. I'm saying you could look at those for some reference.
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Re: Pickup Query

Post by muttley »

Yep thats why I started with this...
On point 2 you have some options as you can either have a strat coil mounted in a humbucker case, get a humbucker and split the coils or look into something along the lines of the Wide Range fender style buckers. I could help you out with any of the above..
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