The Tone Thread

New Guitar Day? Obsessed with tone? 10 on the volume dial not enough? Celestion vs. Electrovoice? Cum in, feel the noize.
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JD01
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The Tone Thread

Post by JD01 »

I think really Greg should be starting The Tone Thread... but I'm actually working on some tones today.

First is my amp with no additional EQ - it has the familiar Blackstar boxiness.
EQ test 1 is a couple of db cut at 200 and 400, but slightly more at 400 and slight increases across 3.2k - 6.4k
EQ test 2 is similar to the above but this time the cut is slightly larger at 200 and slightly smaller at 400, I've also very slightly reduced the 6.4k boost.

I think test 1 sounds a bit heavy metalish, test 2 reintroduces a touch of boxiness but not too much and at the moment its my favourite of the three...

Aside from buy a better cab, any tips on where to go next?

No EQ:


Test 1:


Test 2:
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JD01
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Re: The Tone Thread

Post by JD01 »

Next experiment is dual miking. I couldnt' get the right bracket for my AKG condenser to sit in the right place so I used the cheap focusrite one.

The first clip is with both signals coming in at -18db and left like that.
The 2nd one is with the condenser being reduced by about 6 or 7 db

Dual Mic:


Condenser -6db:


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ido1957
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Re: The Tone Thread

Post by ido1957 »

For the first set - I like the first track mostly. #2 is thinner sounding. #3 has a sort of cool sound and better than 2.
For the second set - right away it sounded like room came alive on #1. It's like a reverb type sound which would sound "live" er in a mix.
People want something for nothing, they want it right now. Either they can't tell quality or don't care but feel it is important that everyone agrees with them.
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JD01
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Re: The Tone Thread

Post by JD01 »

ido1957 wrote:For the first set - I like the first track mostly. #2 is thinner sounding. #3 has a sort of cool sound and better than 2.
For the second set - right away it sounded like room came alive on #1. It's like a reverb type sound which would sound "live" er in a mix.
Ah, I think the first tone sounds like there's a sleeping bag over in the amp!

I've just mixed together the final tone from the first set EQ Test 2 and the one from the 2nd test with the condenser turned down by a few db. I'm definitely pleased with how they fit together. I think I am slowly edging closer to the tone I want - after 2 years of posting on the old New Tone Thread.

Check this out:
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WhiskeyJack
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Re: The Tone Thread

Post by WhiskeyJack »

Happy to see this here JD.
:happytrees:
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TheTestingYak
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Re: The Tone Thread

Post by TheTestingYak »

Gud Choon Bruh.
Good Choon Brav.
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JD01
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Re: The Tone Thread

Post by JD01 »

WhiskeyJack wrote:Happy to see this here JD.
Yeah, hopefully it takes off as it did before. I'm not the right person to be starting this really but I actually did spend a while on Sunday afternoon chasing tones as I've got no new tunes that needs writing or tracking. Although I did end up doing some re-tracking with combined mics on one of them.
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Re: The Tone Thread

Post by Greg_L »

Lol I saw this yesterday and forgot to come back to it.

I'll check out your tones a little later.

Vive le Tone Thread!

It'd be awesome if we could somehow morph all of the old tone thread into this one.
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JD01
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Re: The Tone Thread

Post by JD01 »

Greg_L wrote:Lol I saw this yesterday and forgot to come back to it.

I'll check out your tones a little later.

Vive le Tone Thread!
Cheers, Greg. Would be interested to know what you think. I'm pretty happy with them - not the tones in particular, although they're alright - but more that I am starting to learn what changes I need to make in my tweaking to achieve the sound I want.
Greg_L wrote:It'd be awesome if we could somehow morph all of the old tone thread into this one.
We need someone with a LOT of time on their hands to do a LOT of copy and paste.
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Re: The Tone Thread

Post by Greg_L »

JD01 wrote: Cheers, Greg. Would be interested to know what you think. I'm pretty happy with them - not the tones in particular, although they're alright - but more that I am starting to learn what changes I need to make in my tweaking to achieve the sound I want.
Greg_L wrote:It'd be awesome if we could somehow morph all of the old tone thread into this one.
We need someone with a LOT of time on their hands to do a LOT of copy and paste.
Is that what it would take? Manual copying and pasting? Holy sweet crap.
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JD01
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Re: The Tone Thread

Post by JD01 »

Greg_L wrote:
JD01 wrote: Cheers, Greg. Would be interested to know what you think. I'm pretty happy with them - not the tones in particular, although they're alright - but more that I am starting to learn what changes I need to make in my tweaking to achieve the sound I want.
We need someone with a LOT of time on their hands to do a LOT of copy and paste.
Is that what it would take? Manual copying and pasting? Holy sweet crap.
I can't think of another way unless there is a way for an admin of HR to do some sort of archive function that can then be moved... but this is php whereas that was vBull so there's probably a difference in the way the database is arranged...

Also, I'm not sure I want my first tones when I joined of a Marshall Jackhammer pedal into a GearBox ampsim to ever see the light of day again...
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Re: The Tone Thread

Post by WhiskeyJack »

Greg_L wrote:Lol I saw this yesterday and forgot to come back to it.

I'll check out your tones a little later.

Vive le Tone Thread!

It'd be awesome if we could somehow morph all of the old tone thread into this one.
This is on my list of things to do.
:happytrees:
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Re: The Tone Thread

Post by Greg_L »

JD01 wrote:Next experiment is dual miking. I couldnt' get the right bracket for my AKG condenser to sit in the right place so I used the cheap focusrite one.

The first clip is with both signals coming in at -18db and left like that.
The 2nd one is with the condenser being reduced by about 6 or 7 db

Dual Mic:


Condenser -6db:


Out of these, the "Condenser reduced" is by far better to me. It has some meat but it's not as woofy as the other one.


JD01 wrote:I think really Greg should be starting The Tone Thread... but I'm actually working on some tones today.

First is my amp with no additional EQ - it has the familiar Blackstar boxiness.
EQ test 1 is a couple of db cut at 200 and 400, but slightly more at 400 and slight increases across 3.2k - 6.4k
EQ test 2 is similar to the above but this time the cut is slightly larger at 200 and slightly smaller at 400, I've also very slightly reduced the 6.4k boost.

I think test 1 sounds a bit heavy metalish, test 2 reintroduces a touch of boxiness but not too much and at the moment its my favourite of the three...

Aside from buy a better cab, any tips on where to go next?

No EQ:


Test 1:


Test 2:
"Test 2" sounds the best to me. No EQ is poo. Sounds like the amp is in a small box. No no dice on that one. Test 1 is okay, but what highs there are seem a little harsh. Test 2 has the better low end with a smoother top end, but it's still lacking "air".

All of your clips lack air, presence, whatever you wanna call it. There is no chime or sparkle. If you can't get it at the amp for whatever reason, theen try adding it with EQ in the DAW.
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JD01
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Re: The Tone Thread

Post by JD01 »

Cheers, Greg. Of the 5 I think Condenser Reduced is my favourite one. I'm gonna fiddle about with a better condenser next weekend and see if I can improve it further.

Test 2 and Condenser Reduced (which is just Test 2 dual miked) are my favourite tone I've managed at the moment. It seems to sound good both when chugging away on it and strumming it in a more punky style. It's as close as I've managed to get to this:
https://youtu.be/X2u6DeXvLDM?t=78

I re-tracked the guitars to No-Choice with it yesterday evening to see how it fitted in and it added a lot of meat!
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Re: The Tone Thread

Post by ShanPeyton »

Good on you for doing the condenser tone test JD! Every time i set up to record something i ALWAYS throw one of my condensers on the cab somewhere in an effort to capture some more essence of the amp but just about everytime i do all i capture is just shrill garbage tones.

Do you think you could be a sport and show a pic of your mic placement and how you are processing that signal?
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JD01
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Re: The Tone Thread

Post by JD01 »

ShanPeyton wrote:Good on you for doing the condenser tone test JD! Every time i set up to record something i ALWAYS throw one of my condensers on the cab somewhere in an effort to capture some more essence of the amp but just about everytime i do all i capture is just shrill garbage tones.

Do you think you could be a sport and show a pic of your mic placement and how you are processing that signal?
I did in the same post where I posted the condenser clips. Its just below the clips. You'll have to click (or right-click new tab) on it though as its linked to my drive, not uploaded

EDIT: Here you go:


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Re: The Tone Thread

Post by ShanPeyton »

ugh. Sorry JD i didn't see the original post. Hmmm. interesting. Mine is usually set that close. sometimes further back.
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Re: The Tone Thread

Post by JD01 »

ShanPeyton wrote:ugh. Sorry JD i didn't see the original post. Hmmm. interesting. Mine is usually set that close. sometimes further back.
That's literally my first attempt at it. It seems to have worked, so maybe I got lucky - but I have a photo now so I can always go back to it... that reminds me. I need to find a mic clip for an AKG C1000S
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Re: The Tone Thread

Post by Greg_L »

I never use condensers on cabs. I'm usually too loud. I can't turn my pres down low enough to not clip. Minerman used to do it pretty awesomely though. I might give it another try.

I often use two dynamics though.
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Re: The Tone Thread

Post by JD01 »

Greg_L wrote:I never use condensers on cabs. I'm usually too loud. I can't turn my pres down low enough to not clip. Minerman used to do it pretty awesomely though. I might give it another try.

I often use two dynamics though.
Even I had to turn my pre amp gain way down and I'm probably using about 12 of my 20 available Watts. I've ordered another mic clip today so its definitely something I'm gonna play with more. Seems to make my clips sound louder.
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