The Tone Thread

[Greg_L]

Here's a recent track with my new guitar through my recently tube modded amp. The new guitar/amp combo is nominally in the right channel but as I've found a couple of devises recently that are wired the wrong way I've put a loud string bump at the beginning to indicate the channel with the new track.
I had to add a 3db high shelf to the track as it came trough a little dark - that'd be the humbuckers I suppose in addition to my darkish amp/speaker combo.
On the previous iteration of the track I had played open chords and it wasn't entirely satisfactory so I just did the same power chords as the oter guitar side but changed the strum a bit. The guitar amp combo doesn't readily feedback so there's no long starting to squeal sustain for this one - probably enough on the other side anyway.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/rus6sw50h70a6 ... g.mp3?dl=0
Thoughts/suggestions/utterances?

It doesn't sound too bad Ray, but there's a harshness in the crunch. Could be mic placement, could be the high shelf you added. Instead of adding high shelf to counteract darkness, maybe try shelving out some of the darkness.

[rayc]

It doesn't sound too bad Ray, but there's a harshness in the crunch. Could be mic placement, could be the high shelf you added. Instead of adding high shelf to counteract darkness, maybe try shelving out some of the darkness.

greg,
Yeah, good idea - I used to do subtractive rather than additive EQ. I'll try that, thanks.

[rayc]

Instead of adding high shelf to counteract darkness, maybe try shelving out some of the darkness.

Good ears Greg,
I took away some stuff between 200 & 500. To my ears it sounds rather more like the guitar on the other side - possibly too much so but that's easily fixed.
Here's a run through that is, initially, just the two guitars - Mustang on the right/with the bump and Guyatone on the left.
After the intro, a verse & chorus the full mix pops up so that the guitar can be heard in context.
Now I've tried that I'll fiddle around with mic placement etc to see if there's anymore brightness to be tweaked from that aspect.
Thoughts?
https://www.dropbox.com/s/fwkwl9adh1mkg ... s.mp3?dl=0

[Greg_L]

Good ears Greg,
I took away some stuff between 200 & 500. To my ears it sounds rather more like the guitar on the other side - possibly too much so but that's easily fixed.
Here's a run through that is, initially, just the two guitars - Mustang on the right/with the bump and Guyatone on the left.
After the intro, a verse & chorus the full mix pops up so that the guitar can be heard in context.
Now I've tried that I'll fiddle around with mic placement etc to see if there's anymore brightness to be tweaked from that aspect.
Thoughts?
https://www.dropbox.com/s/fwkwl9adh1mkg ... s.mp3?dl=0

I think that is significantly better.

[rammer24]

Before I put vocals on this, I just want to see if I'm on the right track, tone wise.

How are the over all tones? But also, there's a wah wah break that starts at about 2 minutes, followed by a solo.

I just put the drums on, so it might be a little drum heavy, volume-wise. I'll sort it all out when I actually mix it with vocals.

Rawk.mp3

[einstein magoo]

An excellent bed on which to lay some rami vocals!

The tones sound good to me but I'm not your typical expert tone-tard. I expect some will be along to critique the tones as that is the true nature of this thread and can be very valuable.

I'll just say that amps have treble, middle, bass and sometimes presence controls to dial in a tone "you" like. Some amps with graphic eq, etc. This, along with guitar tone knobs going from 0-10 and pickup type and selection along with potential blending of pickups, etc. give us a pretty complete arsenal of sounds (tones) to work with. Add to that mic selection and placement and we can spend hours dicking with stuff to alter our tones. A really "bad" tone sometimes sticks out, but to me, any tone can be usable in the right context. And that context doesn't truly present itself until the vocals are added. I think the vocal sometimes dictates where the guitar tones should be.

My personal preference is whatever works for the all important SONG. I like some fat shit, some thin shit, some tinny stuff, some distorted, some clean, but mainly some variation from one instrument or part to another to keep things interesting, and to cradle the vocal.

Being pretty much an amateur, and a digital recording noob at that, the folks on this forum can pretty much see I don't know what the hell I'm talking about. But I am still a seasoned listener with an ear for what is appealing to ME, and what you have here rami IS appealing. I like your preliminary mix as well.

[rammer24]

Thanx! I agree with everything you said, E.M.

I was just hoping to make sure that this isn't the case:

A really "bad" tone sometimes sticks out

In the verses, I have a second guitar come in and this is the part that worries me the most. It might be too indistinct and cluttering up the mix. I might change that second guitar part that comes in and maybe just play a one-note-at-a-time part, rather than the chords I'm playing now.

[miroslav]

Before I put vocals on this, I just want to see if I'm on the right track, tone wise.

Do you want me post it in the tone and mix thread....I'm sure will give you some tips.

[rammer24]

Wait. I think I might need to turn the bass down 3/4 of a db. I think that's what's cluttering up the WHOLE mix.

[miroslav]

See...he's already helped you out.

[Greg_L]

Sounds great Rambo. Is that the HyBrit still?

[rammer24]

Thanx Greg. No, that's Amplitube 3 "Vintage Metal Lead" which is supposed to be a "Marshall® JMP100™ head". And I put the different tracks through different cab sims of yours. I'm liking it. I was just worried I might not have been hearing some fizz or something.

[miroslav]

I'll check it for fizz on my studio monitors this weekend, if I remember.
I'll be doing some testing with those traps I built...and the studio monitors have a very clear high end.

[rammer24]

I'll check it for fizz on my studio monitors this weekend, if I remember.
I'll be doing some testing with those traps I built...and the studio monitors have a very clear high end.

Awesome.

[Greg_L]

I don't find them fizzy, but they do have some of that high-mid grind that almost borders on harshness. They're not harsh, but that kind of grind can get there pretty easily. The guitars sound pretty much like smoldering Marshalls to me. I think if you wanted you could cut some of the gain and still sound awesome.

[rammer24]

Ok great. I'll try that. I'm a bit guilty of going by numbers rather than using my ears. I actually thought that turning down the gain might be a good thing. But then, I noticed that the gain for the rythms is only at 4, and 5 for the leads. So, I tell myself that can't be too much gain. I know, I need to forget what the numbers say and just listen. But I just couldn't help think that it CAN'T be too much gain.

I just realized each guitar has its own compression pedal on it. I'm using it just for more sustain. But it might also be contributing to that grind. I'll play with it a bit. I forgot about the compressors.

[rammer24]

No, never mind. There are no compressors. I only have one on the solo for some sustain.

[Greg_L]

Ok great. I'll try that. I'm a bit guilty of going by numbers rather than using my ears. I actually thought that turning down the gain might be a good thing. But then, I noticed that the gain for the rythms is only at 4, and 5 for the leads. So, I tell myself that can't be too much gain. I know, I need to forget what the numbers say and just listen. But I just couldn't help think that it CAN'T be too much gain.

I just realized each guitar has its own compression pedal on it. I'm using it just for more sustain. But it might also be contributing to that grind. I'll play with it a bit. I forgot about the compressors.

You can throw all that out the window with sims. The numbers mean nothing. Gain on "4" on an old Marshall in real life would be pretty clean.

[rayc]

Wow, the section before the solo - the bit with the wah & stops - sound really prog - Gentle Gian or Starcastle type. I liked it.
No fizz - sounds cool and very solid. Well Amplituded Rami. You've made a good case for sSIMplicity.

[rammer24]

Wow, the section before the solo - the bit with the wah & stops - sound really prog - Gentle Gian or Starcastle type. I liked it.
No fizz - sounds cool and very solid. Well Amplituded Rami. You've made a good case for sSIMplicity.

You're very punny, young man. Now stop pun-tificating before I pun-ish you.

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